Russian Su-24 shootdown by Turkish Air Force F-16 fighter

Oguzhanoz wrote:page 1.
Each NATO
nation is thus fIree to conduct armed interception of unidentified aircraft if
it so desires.

I read page 3. But theese are for "peace time" strategies.There is a war at south of the border right now.Theoretically a syrian pilot can hijack the plane and traspass Turkish airspace or isis or anyone.
Turkey announced that it set its view of threat to "war" after f/4 is shot down 2-3 years ago,so it started to urge planes to 10 miles away from border.
I am not supporting anything,just my ideas.

1. It is peace time, Turkey is not in war with Syria
2. There is war OUTSIDE your borders
3. Armed interception, not shooting it down, every country has right for armed interception of whatever they desire, but that is not what Turkey did
4. F4 was shot in Syrian teritory

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Well i mean,
Yea tourists are coming to Turkey but,most of to hotel owners in Antalya is Russian.I also worked some of those hotels.And tour agencies are Russian.
This year less Russian came than the previous year but european tourists filled the gap.
I think this economic things will harm both countries,but surely there needed to be done something.However this plane shoot thing done,Russia should do something to show to its people.In return Turkish government will do some things to,we will just see.

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Morocco, was criticized for its seal to replace Turkey on Russian market.

Turkish Olive oil producers going to get hammered.

Theese politics look a little bit harsch.
Well it looks like it is not prepared in 3 days or did ?There can always be found new markets for small jobs,real areas are gas and nuclear relationship.

Oguzhanoz wrote:Theese politics look a little bit harsch.
Well it looks like it is not prepared in 3 days or did ?There can always be found new markets for small jobs,real areas are gas and nuclear relationship.

Like EU did?

Gas and nuke? Kiss those goodbye by default.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Morocco, was criticized for its seal to replace Turkey on Russian market.

Turkish Olive oil producers going to get hammered.

You aren´t an expert in olive oil i guess. The harvest in last and this year was very bad. Prices are extremly high, because very high demand in italy. If you buy it or italy takes it are totally irrelevant.

Oguzhanoz wrote:However this plane shoot thing done,Russia should do something to show to its people.In return Turkish government will do some things to,we will just see.

To show to its people? I don't know what the fuck you're smoking but Turkey de facto declared war on Russia 4 days ago. The same incident would have sparked some serious shit in the Middle East if this was pre-1991. Do you understand this? Your president's first reaction was running to NATO which is quite telling. He wouldn't have done this if he knew he was right. No one in NATO actually backed him up, not even the USA. Yes, they did say some pretty general stuff like "Turkey has a right to defend its territory". Duh, who doesn't? Now we're witnessing childish political manoeuvers from Erdogan. It won't lead to anything because the damage has been done. Frankly, I haven't seen Putin so cynical before. The tone in which he spoke is everything you need to know.

There can be another nuclear partner but Russia's loss is 20b usd
For gas,most analysts say that it is an opportunity to support renewable energy for us.But yea this year might be cold ^^ but it is ia 15b usd loss in 4 months for Russia.

Well i didn'T say that. But theese companies can usually sell their product to inner market with some less earning.But surely they will suffer.


I don't mind what politics say.this move doesn't seem to be accidently.
Firstly they had their air defence systems and let Russian planes move freely.It is not the first time Russia violates Turkish airspace.Almost every week on blacksea. I think this wasn't an accident. Some people planning something.

Neutrality wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:However this plane shoot thing done,Russia should do something to show to its people.In return Turkish government will do some things to,we will just see.

To show to its people? I don't know what the fuck you're smoking but Turkey de facto declared war on Russia 4 days ago. The same incident would have sparked some serious shit in the Middle East if this was pre-1991. Do you understand this? Your president's first reaction was running to NATO which is quite telling. He wouldn't have done this if he knew he was right. No one in NATO actually backed him up, not even the USA. Yes, they did say some pretty general stuff like "Turkey has a right to defend its territory". Duh, who doesn't? Now we're witnessing childish political manoeuvers from Erdogan. It won't lead to anything because the damage has been done. Frankly, I haven't seen Putin so cynical before. The tone in which he spoke is everything you need to know.

I knew shit hit the fan for reals when I saw freakin' Medvedev sharpening the axe on TV...

Oguzhanoz wrote:There can be another nuclear partner but Russia's loss is 20b usd
For gas,most analysts say that it is an opportunity to support renewable energy for us.But yea this year might be cold ^^ but it is ia 15b usd loss in 4 months for Russia.

Well i didn'T say that. But theese companies can usually sell their product to inner market with some less earning.But surely they will suffer.


I don't mind what politics say.this move doesn't seem to be accidently.
Firstly they had their air defence systems and let Russian planes move freely.It is not the first time Russia violates Turkish airspace.Almost every week on blacksea. I think this wasn't an accident. Some people planning something.

They did not lose 20billion, coz they did not invest anything in the project... They simply did not earn 20 billion. Renewal energy to replace natural gas? In next 75 years maybe, but good luck with that anyways

Violation of airspace over Black Sea? Its not Caspian lake, airspace is not divided except coastal airspace. And such incident never happened stop making stuff up please.

SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Morocco, was criticized for its seal to replace Turkey on Russian market.

Turkish Olive oil producers going to get hammered.

You aren´t an expert in olive oil i guess. The harvest in last and this year was very bad. Prices are extremly high, because very high demand in italy. If you buy it or italy takes it are totally irrelevant.

High demand in Italy? Do you understand that Italy has had issues because they have problems with extra-virgin oil and oil volumes. This touches volumes, (Turkish export volumes about 35K tonnes, Tunisia 130K-projected 170 Tonnes). Italy exports are roughly 69K tonnes down from 112K tonnes. Mister expert, take a seat, beacause your market shares in Russia are going down. Also prices are not going up, because the discout chains like Lidl and Aldi are killing the prices.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/shopping-and-consumer-news/11628338/Olive-oil-shortage-is-a-pressing-issue-say-experts.html

So you have "bad harvest" and "rationning".

arpakola wrote:SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Targeted attack? Wow, that was some nice Köfte.

One "poster" here have this little avatar :



And noone seems to give a fuck ... On a "Russia Defence" forum WTH ?

Kadmos45 wrote:One "poster" here have this little avatar :



And noone seems to give a fuck ... On a "Russia Defence" forum WTH ?

>Who cares, it's that Flak has even shot three UFO's. Chill, trolls be trollin.

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Drifting a bit from the theme, me i would not add Romania to that list, considering the rampant russophobia there. But like you said above, there are still plenty of destinations for russian tourists where the locals could be expected to be friendly.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

arpakola wrote:SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Targeted attack? Wow, that was some nice Köfte.

...Add some more roasted kebabs and a side of carved turkey, and your set!

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Morocco, was criticized for its seal to replace Turkey on Russian market.

Turkish Olive oil producers going to get hammered.

You aren´t an expert in olive oil i guess. The harvest in last and this year was very bad. Prices are extremly high, because very high demand in italy. If you buy it or italy takes it are totally irrelevant.

High demand in Italy? Do you understand that Italy has had issues because they have problems with extra-virgin oil and oil volumes. This touches volumes, (Turkish export volumes about 35K tonnes, Tunisia 130K-projected 170 Tonnes). Italy exports are roughly 69K tonnes down from 112K tonnes. Mister expert, take a seat, beacause your market shares in Russia are going down. Also prices are not going up, because the discout chains like Lidl and Aldi are killing the prices.



So you have "bad harvest" and "rationning".

Dude you don´t understand the market. Most of the shit send to russia was punched with cheap sunflower oil, because most russians don´t know the difference and your checks are bad anyways so nobody noticed.

Its harder to sell such stuff in europe so we have to send it pure there, because they know the difference. Thats the only aspect.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

arpakola wrote:SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Targeted attack? Wow, that was some nice Köfte.

laughing about dead syrians?

KoTeMoRe wrote:

And noone seems to give a fuck ... On a "Russia Defence" forum WTH ?

>Who cares, it's that Flak has even shot three UFO's. Chill, trolls be trollin.[/quote]

Unlike russian tanks and aircrafts ...

Anyhow i'm out. We've got too much wehrmacht lovers in Poland already and i'm stuffed with that kind of crap.
Not really expected to see this shit being tolerated here.

Zdrówko

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

arpakola wrote:SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Targeted attack? Wow, that was some nice Köfte.

laughing about dead syrians?

How do you know he was Syrian? Even his parents can't recognize him now.

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Militarov wrote:

Oguzhanoz wrote:I heared about the Russian economic limitations for Turkey.
Can anyone make an analysis ?
I think Russia has the cards of Tourists and Gas. Vegetables and construction works can be replaceable.
What do you think about it ?

Tourist can go to dozen of other destinations, Greece, Montenegro, Croatia, Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Crimea.. those with deeper pockets Morocco, UAE, Singapore, Cuba, South America...

Construction workers from almost whole globe work in Russia, most notably China, Uzbekistan, Serbia, replacing those is not much of an issue.

Vegetables and fruits..well...Greece is now allowed to export to Russia, it should be just fine.

Morocco, was criticized for its seal to replace Turkey on Russian market.

Turkish Olive oil producers going to get hammered.

You aren´t an expert in olive oil i guess. The harvest in last and this year was very bad. Prices are extremly high, because very high demand in italy. If you buy it or italy takes it are totally irrelevant.

High demand in Italy? Do you understand that Italy has had issues because they have problems with extra-virgin oil and oil volumes. This touches volumes, (Turkish export volumes about 35K tonnes, Tunisia 130K-projected 170 Tonnes). Italy exports are roughly 69K tonnes down from 112K tonnes. Mister expert, take a seat, beacause your market shares in Russia are going down. Also prices are not going up, because the discout chains like Lidl and Aldi are killing the prices.



So you have "bad harvest" and "rationning".

Dude you don´t understand the market. Most of the shit send to russia was punched with cheap sunflower oil, because most russians don´t know the difference and your checks are bad anyways so nobody noticed.

Its harder to sell such stuff in europe so we have to send it pure there, because they know the difference. Thats the only aspect.

Pure there? Turkish primary market for olive oil, isn't Europe...it's Saudi Arabia, UAE and Japan. Even Germany buys more oil from Greece than Turkey. Also, just so you know, the Turks 5% of the shares aren't coming back.

Given that Spain and Italy provide about 84% of Russia's olive oil consumption (and Greece 9%) you can try something else troll.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Mustafa wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

arpakola wrote:SYRIA - AZAZ 27-11-2015

Targeted attack? Wow, that was some nice Köfte.

laughing about dead syrians?

How do you know he was Syrian? Even his parents can't recognize him now.

We don´t send own truck drivers over syrian boarder. Our truck drivers are organized in unions and they don´t allow this for insurance reasons. Syrian corporations get hired for this.

The guys who got killed in the trucks are syrian truckers who have extremly hard business because the situation so they basicly take evry offer and contract to be able to feed their families. Most are from Aleppo area.