2020 Nagorno-Karabakh war #1

Armenian wrote:He seems quite worried to me. I think Putin made some kind of deal with Erdoğan and decided to sacrifice Armenians. Not that it makes any sense but Russia is clearly not willing to do anything to help Armenia. Azerbaijan on the other hand is trying to create narrative that missiles are fired from Armenia.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

Armenian wrote:Pashinyan just called all people served in army in the last year. He stated that it's not about NKR anymore and there is a real danger of a new Armenian genocide.

He seems quite worried to me. I think Putin made some kind of deal with Erdoğan and decided to sacrifice Armenians. Not that it makes any sense but Russia is clearly not willing to do anything to help Armenia. Azerbaijan on the other hand is trying to create narrative that missiles are fired from Armenia.

The purpose is clear. Attacking Armenia.

Some people here might find this exaggerated but I think we are really on our own against Turks. Land inversion to Armenia is real possibility.

Not only Russia but the whole world is watching Armenians to be massacred again. In the 21st century.

medo wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

Artzakh is Armenian land for more than 2500 years. Communists under Stalin stolen this Armenian land and give it to Azerbaijan. It is Azerbaijan who is occupying stolen land. Azerbaijan should return stolen land to the real owners. You could  not be an occupier on your own land. You could only be an owner.

miketheterrible wrote:Well, seeing as a huge portion of land Russia obtained are from countries/civilizations that don't really exist anymore, can't say it's a fair comparison.

But the fact it's land that under UN isn't recognized as Armenian and Russia agreed to that, kinda puts things into perspective for Armenians.  No one will help them in that land but they themselves.

My only guess will be Russia providing Armenia with weapons like how Turkey does for Azerbaijan.  That's about it

Armenian wrote:Pashinyan just called all people served in army in the last year. He stated that it's not about NKR anymore and there is a real danger of a new Armenian genocide.

He seems quite worried to me. I think Putin made some kind of deal with Erdoğan and decided to sacrifice Armenians. Not that it makes any sense but Russia is clearly not willing to do anything to help Armenia. Azerbaijan on the other hand is trying to create narrative that missiles are fired from Armenia.

The purpose is clear. Attacking Armenia.

Some people here might find this exaggerated but I think we are really on our own against Turks. Land inversion to Armenia is real possibility.

Not only Russia but the whole world is watching Armenians to be massacred again. In the 21st century.

ЕРЕВАН, 4 окт — Sputnik. Пилоты всех самолетов ВС Азербайджана, сбитых в зоне карабахского конфликта, не катапультируются, сообщил представитель Минобороны Армении Арцрун Ованнисян на своей странице в Facebook

"Примечательная особенность: летчики всех сбитых азербайджанских самолетов падают камнем на землю вместе с самолетом. Никто не катапультируется. Возникает вопрос: а, быть может, не могут, потому что катапульта отключена? То есть Азербайджану плевать не только на войска, но и на самых ценных военных специалистов. Эта точка зрения подкрепляется тем, что тела пилотов остаются на полях", - отметил Ованнисян.

YEREVAN, 4 October - Sputnik. The pilots of all aircraft of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces, shot down in the zone of the Karabakh conflict, are not ejected, the representative of the Armenian Defense Ministry Artsrun Hovhannisyan said on his Facebook page.

"A remarkable feature: the pilots of all downed Azerbaijani planes fall like a stone to the ground along with the valuable military specialists. This point of view is supported by the fact that the bodies of the pilots remain in the fields, "Hovhannisyan said.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

Armenian wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

By your logic Crimea is occupied as well? No, its people living in their historical lands and everybody here knows it.

Thinking that it's about Karabakh is extremely naive. It's about wiping out all Armenians from the region to create Turkic empire. We all know Erdoğan and we all know what he wants.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

miketheterrible wrote:Well, seeing as a huge portion of land Russia obtained are from countries/civilizations that don't really exist anymore, can't say it's a fair comparison.

But the fact it's land that under UN isn't recognized as Armenian and Russia agreed to that, kinda puts things into perspective for Armenians.  No one will help them in that land but they themselves.

My only guess will be Russia providing Armenia with weapons like how Turkey does for Azerbaijan.  That's about it

Japan exists, China exists, Germany exists etc, a lot of the areas I speak of the respective countries do exist.

So it's quite a fair comparison.

Why yes but that doesn't matter that Russia nor the UN see it has Azeri land, the standard is "Historical" it belongs to Armenia there-fore its Armenian land. So I assume for people going with that logic, they will apply the same logic to all is my point.

medo wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

Artzakh is Armenian land for more than 2500 years. Communists under Stalin stolen this Armenian land and give it to Azerbaijan. It is Azerbaijan who is occupying stolen land. Azerbaijan should return stolen land to the real owners. You could  not be an occupier on your own land. You could only be an owner.

miketheterrible wrote:Did Armenia recognize Crimea as Russian though?  Because if not, then the favor may be returned and Russia didn't bother recognizing Karabakh.

I think because land is disputed, Russia won't help. But if Armenia proper gets hit, well....

The anti Russian nonsense Armenia pushed for a bit there may be coming home to roost. Cause their new US and EU partners don't seem to be helping either.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

medo wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

Armenian wrote:

Isos wrote:Armenia never asked for russian help.

Nikol called Putin 3 times. Do you think he called to ask how is the weather is in Moscow?

Of course he asked for help and now we can guess the answer. The reason of not officially asking help is pure political to show the enemy that we have cards.

That is an occupied region, if Armenia is so worried about a genocide they can move people into Armenia.

Moscow has made it clear they will not help Armenia over land even they consider occupied.

Artzakh is Armenian land for more than 2500 years. Communists under Stalin stolen this Armenian land and give it to Azerbaijan. It is Azerbaijan who is occupying stolen land. Azerbaijan should return stolen land to the real owners. You could  not be an occupier on your own land. You could only be an owner.

Ah if that's the standard we are going by....then The Kuril Islands need to be returned to Japan, The Sixty-Four Villages East of the River need to be returned to China and there are other parts of Russia that historical belong to other countries.

Long story short if you going to pull that excuse then I assume you support the Russians returning land that historical belongs to others~

nomadski wrote:
Tony stark here. If report is genuine. Russia will not help defend Armenia. Then maybe because economic importance of Turkey / EU relationship far greater than Economic or strategic importance of little Armenia. They can still trade through Asia. Even if ongoing war in caucases. Without Dollar sanctions. Ukraine sanctions still remain.

But this is short termism. Leaving the problem for tomorrow. Iran however looses much more, if  Turkey gains control over caucases. Stablishes a land and sea blockade against trade with Russia. And encourages separatism in Iran. So Iran much more likely to check Turkey moves against Armenia.

This leaves Europe. That I think will make noises, if Turkey removed Armenia. But because Turkey is NATO,  and will put pressure on Iran and Russia. They will practically do nothing. Even if Armenia joins NATO. They will be sacrificial lamb. Like Cyprus.

So best plan is for Iran to support Armenia. But since Iran has big Azeri population, and they feel bad about occupation of some territory. Then Armenia could compromise, to appease them. Armenia can even join Iran as free state and ally. The economic interests of Armenia, will be served by Iran. Despite sanctions, Iran economy is doing relatively well, with positive growth. Iran needs them most.

But if Armenia joins NAZTO, and is thrown under a bus, to let Turkish troops pass. Then Iran will respond with force against them. This I am sure about. And nobody gains. Not Russians or Europeans or Russians or even Iranians. But I think even then, we will come on top.

Stark out.

Tai Hai Chen wrote:
It doesn't matter if Russia helps Armenia or not. If Russia does not help, America or Iran will step in, Russia will lose another ally in the region.

miketheterrible wrote:Did Armenia recognize Crimea as Russian though?  Because if not, then the favor may be returned and Russia didn't bother recognizing Karabakh.

I think because land is disputed, Russia won't help. But if Armenia proper gets hit, well....

The anti Russian nonsense Armenia pushed for a bit there may be coming home to roost. Cause their new US and EU partners don't seem to be helping either.