Unbridled jingoism? All the other foreigners here support their own states
Not when it is wrong I don't.
NZ didn't join in the criticism of China, but they are talking about the situation in the Ukraine from the US point of view which I cannot support.
And lol at the dimwit suggesting that Peskov's comments are a misdirection and 6D chess
Peskov and other officials have been giving their own personal opinions... I realise they would be arrested in the west and put in prison for treason, but people are entitled to their own view.
I haven't read all of the previous comments in this thread but what is it with German intelligence intercepting radio transmissions about Russian soldiers talking about killing Ukrainian civilians in the town of Bucha? This is being used as evidence of war crimes. Don't get angry with me please because I want to hear from another source not in the West.
I wonder if they have anything to do with the German Chemical labs that found Novachok on Navalny?
Honestly how could they tell Russians speaking Russian from Ukrainians speaking Russian and pretending to be Russian soldiers... that is assuming these recordings even exist... maybe what they intercepted is MI6 planning the killings in Russian... to frame Russia.
But in the end it doesn't matter... Putin wont go to trial for a fake massacre just like no US president stood trial for the very real massacre at Mi Lai in Vietnam.
After the white helmets and take gas attack in order to instigate western involvement in Syria,I am extremely skeptical of western propaganda, particularly when the west has everything to gain from it and it is voiced from Intel agency backed NGOs and msm.
And it is only going to get worse as Ukrainian soldiers put on civilian clothes and pretend to be civies and use civilian transport.
then the Russian's have outright said they didn't do it and that they are indeed open for having an independent investigation done to which the west (UK the biggest one) said no. So as soon as they said no, that pretty much cleared the air as to what this is all about. The west will of course try their best to come up with any fake evidence. I mean, it doesnt take a genius to get Ukrainians to talk into radio and make themselves sound Russian. Doesn't matter how ridiculous it all sounds.
The west didn't wait for investigations into alledged chemical weapons attacks in Syria and of course we know why because after the investigation they were proved to be fake... but the west had already launched its missile strike anyway... which was mostly useless anyway.
Disagree.
This shit is being produced to push undecided to a side.
That is true, but when it is proven to be false then what will happen to those undecided?
If China will change its mind, it will be an economic game over for Russia, we realize that.
China can't change its mind... if it does then it is next and it will have to face the west without Russia...
China knows exactly what is happening, and it doing what it needs to do to make sure it and Russia survive and prosper.
The biggest mistake Russia did, is not creating alternative communication channels combined with a world audience.
Rutube should be booming, but it is not.
But they did... RT might be blocked in the west, but not the rest of the world.
They put all eggs into RT basket if you ask me, and now they have faced just a cut-off of a whole 10+ years of a good job done.
This part was not prepared for a war. Maybe they lacked time, IDK
It was so successful western media companies became desperate for a reason to block it and it was being limited and its workers harrassed before this conflict even started... 8 years ago.
People on this forum are really naive about war. War crimes do happen, especially in conflicts that include huge mass of civilian population caught in the middle of it.
Of course they do, Kiev has been shelling its own civilians claiming they are Russians occupying Ukrainian territory because they prefer to speak Russian.... that is a warcrime.
The Russian soldiers would not benefit from murdering enemy civilians however, so it really does not make sense... especially when the victims are found out in the streets four days after the Russians left and when they left no mention was made of any civilians being killed.
Regarding Bucha - real deal will be once International court prosecutors start to dig for facts.
When you say international you mean European, which has no power to decide anything at all and has proven to be a tool of the US to prosecute Serbs and other people it does not like at the moment.
On the other side Russia just denies and will never ever accept international court jurisdiction but just denying is not enough - the level of violence in Ukraine is mind blowing and it is two sided so Russian position is really weak.
Actually their position is quite strong because the west has proven to do this sort of thing all the time.... Russia not so much.
Prosecution will go after chain command.
Western prosecution will go after Putin because that has been the goal all along.
They will them use these weapons to shoot down a passenger jet liner either during take off or landing and subsequently the U.S and U.K will accuse Russia for being involved in the attack/s.
Not just MANPADS... imagine taking an ATGM into a busy city and looking for a fuel tanker truck to fire a rocket at in heavy traffic or as it enters a tunnel...
That's right. Some Finns like me are now just a bit worried if there will US bases in Finland.
But as Lavrov said earlier this year "It's Finland's own business, but Russia hopes Finland not to join"
Russia can't tell Finland what to do, but common sense is that if Finland starts inviting US bases and weapons and HATO equipment then Russia will have to respond and Finland might not like that response but then Russia has no say in what Finland does Finland has no say in what Russia does either.
Not a problem now but after they do what they will do it might be too late to go back to what we have now.
But I am sure whatever happens America will tell you it is all Putins fault.
Apart from everything else, Russia doesn't typically fire against any targets in cities during the day. It also doesn't have Tochka-Us in service since 10 years ago but that goes without saying. It has them in storage and could in theory recommission them, but we haven't seen Russia use them in this conflict at all. It sticks to more modern and precise weapons.
Tochka uses the same guidance as Iskander and is very accurate, but a cluster warhead is for area targets of course.
One of Elenski´s buddies first claimed it was a Iskander, then the clown himself said it was a Totchka.
The gridfins prove it is Tochka. Iskander does not use conventional control surfaces.
Nah, standardize them with American equipment i see. But of course, those with industries leftover from Soviet era will lose their manufacturing capability. Poland is expected to lost their tank manufacturing industries and expertise. and many others.
That was the advice from America for Russia in the 1990s... you don't need to make anything... you have oil and gas and when you sell that to us you can use the Euros and US dollars you make to buy everything you need from us in the west, so the west gets cheap energy and Russia buys its shit with the money they make from it.
Eastern Europe doesn't need a military industrial complex because it is competition for the US... they can just borrow money to buy US stuff.
Maybe the longer it last the more time we have to strengthen the currency and to reorient the trade
Even if it ends tomorrow, Putin is now certain that the west wants Russians dead.
Nazis and bio weapons and nukes were all optimised and selectively chosen tools to wind up Putin and Russians... it happened under Obama but continued under Trump so this was going to happen.
Russia needs to realise the west will always hate it and try to destroy it and it needs to look to the rest of the world for growth and development.... which is going to be good for the rest of the world because the west controls and contains every country... Russia and China and soon India wont... a powerful growing China is no threat to Russia and a powerful and growing Russia is not threat to China.
It is the US that refuses to share power....
Russia will have to switch suppliers to Asia but this will both take time and be expensive. Then again I think it will be worse for Europe.
It will take time and be expensive, but it will also be worth it because it doesn't just break the chains and ropes the west uses to control Russia, it creates rest of teh world alternatives for things the west has control of... that the rest of the world can use to bypass western control too.
It is like the US using the US dollar as a weapon... by using it as a weapon they are destroying it and themselves... Russia should not help them in any way.
I am disgusted by most European nations that are supporting and whitewashing these reckless fascists.
Pretty sure Putin realises... he didn't start this attack for fun and has not recklessly thrown the Russian military around for fun... he knows this is a fundamental break with the west... with the US really, but I am sure they will continue to have relations with parts of the west that resist total US control.
They will continue to sell gas and oil, but in rubles and not euros or dollars... they will likely sell other products like fertiliser too, but they have given up any possibility of good relations with the west until the west does not mean the US.
How much hardship will europe put up with for washington... only the people of the eu can say.
Zelensky needs to face criminal charges in the Hague along with his generals. I would make that a condition of any agreement now.
The Hague... they would give him a medal because he is not a Serb.
That was very ignorant, you know !
It was a reasonable response to the original post.
If you posted something and I said I normally don't like the shit you post but this was good I wouldn't expect you to be my best friend either.
Telling someone who said they don't like my posts that they should just ignore me is good advice I think, unless you came here to read things you don't like, which is also OK but the advice is still sound.
It is like the people who get offended at certain TV programmes... well just don't watch them obviously.
Subsiquent discussion about this is going to be moved to the talking bollocks thread where it belongs....
And I hope the ratio is not actually that high. Else who will be left in the Ukraine, just women, kids and old people?
Suicide attacks are costly, especially when the opposition has air and artillery... not to mention ukrainian nazis who don't care about civilians or their own soldiers and use them like bullets.
There's no point destroying Russia if you end up destroying yourself too. I don't think the West will risk it
The west thinks the world needs the west... it is the centre of technology and morally and ethically right about everything... without the west Russia will collapse and when Russia collapses the west will use the abundant resoruces of Russia to then defeat China... which they might lose a lot fo Indian soldiers in that battle but it will be worth it because they are not white and there are too many of them... they make the west nervious...
FP, do you really think that the United States has the strength to strike at Saudi Arabia, Algeria, Egypt, Iran, Venezuela?
Those countries could easily strike back by refusing any and all use of the US dollar or the Euro... the more countries do that the more problems the US will have...
General Waldemar Skrzypczak, former head of the Polish
ground forces, has called for the Russian
enclave of Kaliningrad to be incorporated into Poland.
However, Kaliningrad (formerly called Königsberg) was never Polish, but German.
Former head of a miliary unit in Kaliningrad should call for Poland to be incorporated into Kaliningrad as well as the Baltic states of course...
These are designed to be used against masses of soft targets in an open field, there are no such Russian or separatist ditto within range, given the established trajectory, so there's no legitimate military reason to fire it in this direction at all.
They have a range of warhead options and the cluster munition warhead is specifically for dealing with groups of people in the open without cover... it would be useless against armour or dug in troop positions, but ideal for advancing troops in the open, or in this case retreating civilians.
And like in Bucha, like in Kramatorsk, there will be something that will betray them each time. And people in the Ukraine will notice, and are noticing. Kiev is simply shortening its own lifespan for the sake of some media headlines
I noticed Western leaders have been mum on Kramatorsk today since the very initial report. Looks like they're opting to bury it. Can't really be spun can it.
And the more rabid their dog becomes the more they will want Russia to put it down for them... because they wont.
The people of the Ukraine aren't stupid, but many are quite desperate...
Even then, the West was not bothered by communism (communism was just a cover), but even then, as now, the main obstacle was Russia.
The British have been hating the Russians for centuries... nothing at all to do with Communism.
Here in New Zealand we have coastal artillery built in some major ports to deal with invasions of Russians... the one here in Dunedin was built in 1889 or so.
Russia's reluctance to destroy Ukraine is only being viewed as a weakness by NATzO.
The HATO view of Russia is meaningless. Ukraines view of Russia will determine their future shape and relations.
GARRY, if there are major problems with the West (and there are pro-Russian forumers from the West here), I expect you to lead all of us forum members into a decisive battle against fascism!
I can run a forum, but not equipped or interested in fighting a war.
Russia does not need to fight the west... when Russia and China and other countries start to split with the west it is the west that will realise how much it depends on the rest of the world... I am hoping europe will work out the damage this conflict has done to it and that it was all so unnecessary but a plan created and driven from Washington... the sooner each individual country of the west grows up and realises it has a responsibility to its own citizens to do things in its own interests rather than just following orders from the US that only ever benefit the US and even then only the rich and powerful in the US... maybe the people of the US will realise this too and those zombie movies might come true where the majority will rise up and consume the 1% with more money and power than any human should ever be allowed to have.
It is not a war for Russia to fight, they will set up defences and man trenches but once they have sorted out Ukraine this is it... they don't care about the rest and it is not their job to save Europe from the US.
Let them watch the growth and development possible when there is no US standing over you holding you down and controlling you.
More importantly watch how China also grows and any other country that joins their silk road and other projects to promote trade... the silk road was a trade route from Asia to the EU but simply linking all those countries together is enough... it can increase trade amongst all the countries without actually going into the EU... they could divert the route through the middle east into africa and have trade from africa to asia boosting economies and promoting growth and development while the EU stagnates and imposes more sanctions.
Apparently the Ukraine is going to get 16 of these things
https://t.me/new_militarycolumnist/79769
Self-propelled 155mm Slovak artillery
They are going to have to send a lot of ammo...
Important they don't mix those up too because 155mm and 152mm are not mix and match...
Missiles vs. length of operation. I wonder how many months of operation Russia can sustain current rate of cruise missiles usage? I hope there are hundreds still in stock. NAtoZI are going to supply new ammo and weapons to nazi junta to keep war going... :/
They will have enormous stocks of updated anti ship missiles they could use with land attack capability... a lot of the older missiles were relatively slow and easy targets for a modern ships defences but against fixed land targets they are accurate enough and generally have a 1 ton warhead to sink a bigish ship and their subsonic approach speed is not a problem... if they shoot it down with SAMs then that is using up their SAMs... if they don't shoot them down it is still using up SAMs and destroying targets as well... they will have enormous numbers of missiles like Granit and Vulcan they can use up like this...
Air launched missils like the old Kh-22Ms could also be used up in this way too... just not the ones with nuke warheads of course... yet.
The West ultimately has the advantage. It has $300 billion in confiscated Russian money to produce arms with and invest into R&D. It can supply everything to the Ukraine.
Not at all because those 300 billion dollars can be seized in western assets in Russia by Russia in response so those 300 billion in the western banks will need to be paid in compensation to those companies who lost assets in Russia...
Russia probably still has plenty of missiles but it needs them in case of war with NATO.
Not they don't.
Any conflict with HATO will be nuclear... conventional missiles not required... that will send a message.
Will the west suffer any consequences for actually using confiscated Russian reserves?
It totally undermines the concepts of western economics if they can choose to confiscate a countries foreign reserves... this will lead to countries not keeping their money in the western bank system.
And of course the west has not made it clear what it is doing with Russian money... as soon as they make public that various things are being paid for this way then Russia can sit down and decide a response, but it will likely be seizing western assets in Russia to an equivalent value... like McDonalds... they can seize ownership and keep them operating so workers don't lose their jobs and local food providers can keep their contracts... they could redesign the model and start changing the brand design to something more Russian... and not just McDonalds.
I would leave the food companies that refused to sabotage world food prices by taking action against Russia, but the ones like Apple are all fair game... there will likely be factories and other things they have making stuff there too... car companies, computer companies etc etc.
I am sure they have already made a list.
Btw, why aren't Russian BMP-3s equipped with ERA blocks and applique armor?
Against enemy cannon fire or HMG fire or light anti armour weapons like RPG-22 it is effective but against most modern anti tank stuff it is not so effective I suspect.
APS systems would be more useful I suspect and getting more into service should be a priority.
Krasnopol rounds are nice and all, but they are very expensive. Was there a project in Russia to have PGM kits to convert old stocks into a bit more precise munitions?
Krasnopol rounds are cheap... they are just laser homing. There is a new fuse system that has control fins and GLONASS attached to it that fits the fuse pockets of 152mm calibre and larger ammo including 160mm mortar rounds and 240mm mortar rounds and 180mm artillery and 203mm artillery.
They were talking about them for quite some time for use on Coalition... 10m CEP day night and all weather over 70km firing distance.... by now probably further improved, but we don't know if it is in service yet.
An advantage of the Krasnopol is the laser target marking which means you can hit moving targets... if the laser target marker is in a drone it is much easier and more responsive.
The Krasnopol round was actually rather cheap and the French were going to buy the modified M model (Krasnopol-M) in 155mm HATO calibre but of course they backed out under US pressure presumably.
On a off topic, how do you guys think that the best Russian special forces compare with the best western special forces? Are they same in skill level and training? How does their weapons systems compare?
They seem to be very capable in Syria... and in Ukraine... finding targets for long range missiles to hit is a critical part of the system most don't even consider.... having a Buyan ship in the middle of the Caspian Sea with a 2,500km range Kalibre on board means nothing if there are not target coordinates and fight paths that will take it around local known air defence sites to hit a fuel dump or ammo store or HQ.
HQs can probably located easily enough just by cell tower traffic and any sat phone use or unusual antenna on the roof of the building but most other targets need eyes on the ground... which is where spec ops come in.
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The Russian Ministry of Defense in Kramatorsk: An analysis of the radius of destruction of the warhead, as well as the characteristic position of the body of the tail section of the Tochka-U missile unequivocally confirm that it was launched from the southwest direction from Kramatorsk. According to available…
Briefing by Russian Defence Ministry
The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation in Ukraine.
During the night, high-precision air-based missiles destroyed a large ammunition depot of the Ukrainian Armed Forces near the Novomoskovsk, Dnepropetrovsk Region. 
In total, 127 aircraft and 98 helicopters, 425 unmanned aerial vehicles, 2,031 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 228 multiple launch rocket systems, 880 field artillery and mortars, as well as 1,932 units of special military vehicles of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were destroyed during the operation.
