Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15

Azi wrote:
Yes really??? If you are a ukrainian fighter pilot for example....and I will tell you will die 98 % and the war is lost...would you fly the sortie? If I tell you your side will win for sure and the chance to die is only 20 %...would you fly? And in both cases the real situation is the same!

If you compare Taliban with USA, only from technical view and numbers...you would bet not a single Cent on Taliban. Who won?

Pilots live in bases and are highly encouraged to get a wife and kids of their own. Why is that?

Azi wrote:

JohninMK wrote:

Azi wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Hit it up the bum by the look of it. This is the burnt out T-90M seen before.

Looks like the rocket was shot out of the forest. Definitely a hit in the back left.

ZOKA
@200_zoka
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8h
Correction, firendly tank from north hit him.....

For some reason tank was abandoned, crew fled while they blew up tank

He was destroyed by his own forces so that would not be Ghanima

Ah okay...smart move if correct!

Smoke from the tank behind it in the column firing pretty much proves it.

flamming_python wrote:
As for Kharkov, no the withdrawal is too small-scale to affect much, and no-one can seriously spin it as much of a victory.
What does concern me is the fate of the villages Russia withdrew from. It's a betrayal, many of these Kharkov settlements actually support Russia. What I can say is that after Bucha, everyone friendly-disposed would have taken up the Russian offer this time around to evacuate temporarily, until Russia returns there.

I read that 5/6 of the settlements were described as 'abandoned'. But I take your point.

Not a complete withdrawal so far it seems.

@Suriyak
@Suriyakmaps
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35m
During seventy sixth day of combats #UkrainianArmy continue advancing north of #Kharkiv & recaptured the village of Pytomnyk/Питомник. Meanwhile, clashes continue at Slobozhanske, which means Lyptsi/Липці town still under #RussianArmy control.


Meanwhile

GEROMAN -- -
@GeromanAT
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1h
lots of stories right now
one is clear - I never saw such a good OPSEC like in that conflict so far.

The gas going to Hungary? Seems like someone knows how to squeeze its "enemies"...

Azi wrote:

lyle6 wrote:Men are meat. Your morale, spirit, elan, call it whatever, will not save you when the bullet meets the bone.

Yes really??? If you are a ukrainian fighter pilot for example....and I will tell you will die 98 % and the war is lost...would you fly the sortie? If I tell you your side will win for sure and the chance to die is only 20 %...would you fly? And in both cases the real situation is the same!

If you compare Taliban with USA, only from technical view and numbers...you would bet not a single Cent on Taliban. Who won?

Take the jet fly below radar and land somewhere near the russian border and get captured and give the plane in good hopes that you will not be exchanged as a POW. Best chance to not be used as the pig who is sent to the minefield to see if there are still mines or not.

limb wrote:The poles want to enter west Ukraine just like the US occupied northern Syria. They hope article 5 will discourage the Russians from destroying them. Given the pussyfooting of Russian politicians, that's kind of plausible. The poles will be safe as long as they have some US special forces embedded into their formation. This will make the Russians pussy out just like they pussies out in not bombing attacking Al Tanf and the YPG occupied oil fields.

If you think the situation in Ukraine and Syria is the same, you would be sorrily mistaken. In Syria, Russia risks being embedded into a conflict with a difficult strategic situation, where US aligned Turkey basically covers the entire northern border of Syria, US aligned Jordan is close to Al Tanf, and US occupied Iraq covers most of the rest. As we have seen today where Turkey stopped Russian overflights of their territory towards Syria, in the worst case Russia would have to supply Syria by the ocean and those waters are swimming with NATO ships as well. Also, Syria is not that relevant in strategic terms to Russia, sure it is nice to have a warm water port in the Med, but not Ukraine level relevant.
Poland and Bulgaria also thought Russia wouldn't cut the gas if they didn't pay, because they didn't cut the gas for Ukraine. But Poland and Bulgaria are not Ukraine. And Syria is not Ukraine either. You can bet those NATO troops have a pretty good chance of being hit if they go into Ukraine regardless of US troops being there or not.

ATLASCUB wrote:The gas going to Hungary? Seems like someone knows how to squeeze its "enemies"...

Hungary AFAIK gets all its gas via the Balkan Stream today. Russia -> TurkStream -> Balkan Stream.
It is Slovakia, Czech Republic, and Germany which still get gas via Ukraine.

Russia flies through Iran then Iraq mostly now to Syria. It's a longer and more expensive flight but....

JohninMK wrote:Hit it up the bum by the look of it. This is the burnt out T-90M seen before.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1523979424433156096

Where was the infantry support and situational awareness? How can you say that the russians know combined arms warfare when tanks just get parked by forests without any recon? The lesson from this conflict is that any tank that parks by forest lines is a dead tank. Tanks aren't made to be close top forests or travel down roads. Theyre supposed to shoot HE shells from 4+km away. Any closer is where infantry comes in.

lancelot wrote:

limb wrote:The poles want to enter west Ukraine just like the US occupied northern Syria. They hope article 5 will discourage the Russians from destroying them. Given the pussyfooting of Russian politicians, that's kind of plausible. The poles will be safe as long as they have some US special forces embedded into their formation. This will make the Russians pussy out just like they pussies out in not bombing attacking Al Tanf and the YPG occupied oil fields.

If you think the situation in Ukraine and Syria is the same, you would be sorrily mistaken. In Syria, Russia risks being embedded into a conflict with a difficult strategic situation, where US aligned Turkey basically covers the entire northern border of Syria, US aligned Jordan is close to Al Tanf, and US occupied Iraq covers most of the rest. As we have seen today where Turkey stopped Russian overflights of their territory towards Syria, in the worst case Russia would have to supply Syria by the ocean and those waters are swimming with NATO ships as well. Also, Syria is not that relevant in strategic terms to Russia, sure it is nice to have a warm water port in the Med, but not Ukraine level relevant.
Poland and Bulgaria also thought Russia wouldn't cut the gas if they didn't pay, because they didn't cut the gas for Ukraine. But Poland and Bulgaria are not Ukraine. And Syria is not Ukraine either. You can bet those NATO troops have a pretty good chance of being hit if they go into Ukraine regardless of US troops being there or not.

ATLASCUB wrote:The gas going to Hungary? Seems like someone knows how to squeeze its "enemies"...

Hungary AFAIK gets all its gas via the Balkan Stream today. Russia -> TurkStream -> Balkan Stream.
It is Slovakia, Czech Republic, and Germany which still get gas via Ukraine.

I hope what youre saying is true. I'd love to see polish, baltic and lithuanian russophobes seethe over their ground troops getting massacred. But I still have my reservations that russia will do anything other than give a few strong words, and say that it didnt want western ukraine anyway.

Azi wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:
Moral victory never delivered war victory

Moral is irrelevant

I would say that is the most important factor of all....much more important than modern weapons ...

Morale don't count for shit, morals even less so (we had plenty of it over here and it didn't mean f*ck all in the end)

Azi wrote:Without morals there is no fight! When morale is high, you fight to the last man, to the last breath.

Which is precisely what you want them to do

You want every single Ukronazi man, woman and child capable of walking unassisted to march their worthless asses into that woodchipper that Russia arranged for them so they could be disposed of permanently and to make sure that controlling that whole accursed place after the war is easier

Azi wrote:If you compare Taliban with USA, only from technical view and numbers...you would bet not a single Cent on Taliban....

Both USA and USSR made the same stupid mistake that Russia made when this war started: charging for the capital city and then being saddled with insurgency by apes

Fortunately Russia quickly dropped that dumbass approach (not quick enough to save their POWs from becoming eunuchs though)

Had either done in Afghanistan what Russia is doing now in Ukraine they would have won no problem


Never believe your own bullshit (not socialism nor democracy), it exists for others not yourself!

Western media announced a collapse of the Russian economy and an upheaval of society. Nothing like that happened. The ruble is better than ever.
In addition, Russia did a cultural cleansing, getting rid of all the shitty American companies (Macdonals, Starbucks, etc).
It is something impressive what they have done against the world. I envy you guys.

I only hope to live for the day China sells its dollar reserves and brings down the dollar. (It is the poker card of the Chinese). That will seal the end of the United States as an economic superpower.

Ukrainian crowd in Warsaw chanting 'Azovstal'!

https://t.me/DonbassDevushka/5920

Maybe you can go there and join your Azov heroes too?

ArgentinaGuard wrote:Western media announced a collapse of the Russian economy and an upheaval of society. Nothing like that happened. The ruble is better than ever.
In addition, Russia did a cultural cleansing, getting rid of all the shitty American companies (Macdonals, Starbucks, etc).
It is something impressive what they have done against the world. I envy you guys.

I only hope to live for the day China sells its dollar reserves and brings down the dollar. (It is the poker card of the Chinese). That will seal the end of the United States as an economic superpower.

The Chinese and the Saudis both

What Russia needs to do first is give the Western powers the boot in the Ukraine, a firm boot.

PapaDragon wrote:

Azi wrote:The problem with withdrawing from Kharkov is that the Ukraine thinks it can win... morale will increase and more and more people will join the fight.

Good, more Nazis for fertilizer

Azi wrote:In addition, the west will also believe that it can win the war against Russia and deliver more and better weapon systems.

Good, more fuel for the cruise missile fire

Azi wrote:It's not just about the military here, the psychological factor must not be forgotten here. A retreat might save the lives of dozens of Russian soldiers, but many more will die as a result of Ukraine's moral victory.

Moral victory never delivered war victory

Moral is irrelevant

Azi wrote:I don't know if they take that into account in the Russian General Staff? In addition I see Bucha 2.0 incoming.

Too small area for another Bucha

Besides, if Ukrops need another one they will easily manufacture it anywhere they need to

I disagree. Morale is important in any war. Ask Churchill.

Fortunately, the Russian people have a heroic history and tradition. This goes beyond Ukraine, it is a geopolitical war for the fate of the world. Russia fights for traditional values and the preservation of her culture against a sick and dangerous West controlled by dark forces (a globalist elite).
Putin said it again in the speech, "we will not give up traditional values"

Not even fascism is the enemy, in any case it is a caricature of it.
Urcania has no legitimacy. He is a poor hostage. A useful idiot. His population is not aware that they have no future in the West. That mixes with his stupid Russophobia. Unfortunately they are a lost case.

MI6/CIA/NED involvement in sponsoring Nazis in Ukraine goes back decades

Russian supply routes to Izium might be at risk now due to Ukraine's push in the vicinity of Kharkov.

Briefing by Russian Defence Ministry

The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation in Ukraine.

During the night, operational-tactical and army aviation have hit 93 assets, including 2 command posts, 69 areas of manpower and military equipment concentration, as well as 3 ammunition depots of the Ukrainian Armed Forces.

Missile troops and artillery units have hit 407 areas of manpower and military equipment concentration, destroying 13 command posts, 4 positions of Osa-AKM anti-aircraft missile systems and 14 ammunition depots.

The attacks have resulted in the elimination of more than 280 nationalists and up to 59 armoured and motor vehicles.

Russian air defence means have shot down 9 Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles: 4 near Balakleya in Kharkov Region, 3 near Rubezhnoe in Lugansk Region, 1 near Snake Island and 1 Bayraktar-TB2 near Arkhangelskoe in Nikolaev Region overnight.

In total, 164 Ukrainian aircraft and 125 helicopters, 807 unmanned aerial vehicles, 302 anti-aircraft missile systems, 2,998 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 360 multiple launch rocket systems, 1,455 field artillery and mortars, as well as 2,808 units of special military vehicles were destroyed during the operation.

#MoD #Russia #Ukraine #Briefing
@mod_russia_en

It is normal , that Russia helps Russian speakers in Ukraine , against ethnic cleansing . It is also normal for non - Nazi Ukrainians , to " defend " their homeland against this " invasion " . It is also normal for the " West " , to oppose Russian " expansion " . It is normal within the historical perspective of human experience , given more mundane reasons of mutual social conflict , over- population and lack of resources etc . It happened before , and happens now , and will happen again . This is all natural and expected . What is not normal , is the existence of Nazism in Ukraine , that led to this debacle . After the catastrophe of WWII and genocide in concentration camps !


Prolonged wars are bad and should be avoided . They are bad for the economy , and for morale . A war lasting any longer than a few months or at maximum a year , should be avoided . How much is this war costing , per day ? Per month ? When morale fails , it is then , that bullets reach the bone ! It is then , that irrespective of material superiority , the war is lost . But the war is not lost , as long as morale is high , irrespective of material inferiority .

What use are reserves and not deploying conscripts , when enemy reaches our lands ? When they attack our resources ? Therefore commit full forces and win in good time , rather than later . Extend the offensive , into enemy territory , if necessary , from the same columns of strong points . Keeping our forces concentrated and collected in advancing column , allows for local concentration , for destruction of forces . Prioritise one target , at a time . Win a series of small battles , along a narrow front , than winning simultaneously many battles , along a wide front .

Unless by 'the West" you mean a group of bankers in the City of London and their inbred royal family backers, your characterization is a bit too broad.

The 1% which includes some inbreds in the UK and US and a few other places in the west, but as long as the 99% do as they are told then they are the problem too and might as well be thrown in with the scum actually doing this.

If the Russians have these immense forces you speak of, they should have been committed by now or at least parts of them.

Yet I see none of that

The tactics they are using don't require more soldiers to be committed... they are grinding up the Orc army just fine...

Look Western boy, I'm going to tell you something. I doubt what you said. But think about this: this is an existential war for the fate of the world. If Russia were on the brink of future defeat, this is heading for a world war with atomic bombs. Russia is not going to let the West get away with it.

He has to believe Russia is losing because otherwise the west has been lying to him all this time and that would destroy his world view.

If Russia needed more troops what would be stopping them?

Nothing... so the fact that they are not continuously feeding troops into the war suggests it is all going to plan... the fact that the Ukraine probably had more tanks and troops and air defence systems than all of HATO in Europe and they need to be fully reequipped is why they are saying Russia must be losing because otherwise their delusions of HATO superiority wouldn't make much sense.

APS will not be of much use against top attack ATGMs.

Depends on the design... there is no reason an APS system that works on incoming RPGs and ATGMs with direct line of sight cannot be adapted to engage top attack and diving weapons too.

In Kadyrov's channel there is info thet each week couple hundreds of volunteers are trained and sent to Donbass. Volunteers from Russia I would assume but they are not Russian military nor Wagnre people. I wonder which units do they join? LNR/DNR?

They might be expat Ukrainians wanting to go back to their home country and save it from the Kiev/US/US/Nazi influence that made them leave in the first place.

Consider that 50,000 to 100,000 more Russian soldiers (and that's really not much) would bring about a complete defeat of Ukraine very quickly.

You keep saying that but how would these extra soldiers achieve anything different... if you had the extra soldiers you would want to use them to assault cities and there is nothing the orcs would want more is city fighting... have you forgotten WWII so quickly?

The Soviets lured the Germans into urban combat where their air power and armour advantages were eliminated and it became man on man where the weaker force had a much better chance to inflict damage.

Why would Russia adopt such stupid tactics?

Simple... they wont... therefore they don't need the extra troops.

They are grinding up Kievs forces piece by piece day by day... extra troops wont get that done faster... in fact it would massively burden their support lines which are providing food for civilian populations as well as army units... more soldiers is not the solution... Russia does not need to hurry... it is the west that needs this to go away because their promise of defence via EU and HATO is protection and the longer this kicks on countries within HATO will realise who fucking useless they are to a serious ally... but then ask the Afghan government forces and the Kurds everywhere there are Kurds...

Western support has meant bugger all.... a win... on Twatter and Boobtube and Farcebook... and an appearance at the Oscars...

The world goes around many times.... things started badly for Russia with the somewhat botched attempt to win the war quickly.... it didn't work... Russian intelligence blatantly failed, underestimating the adversary.

To be fair they gave the Nazis a chance to solve this with minimal bloodshed and the non nazis a chance to rise up and do the same and neither was interested it seems. It would have been criminal not to try however.

Unless the West implements another devastating economic weapon that paralyzes all Russian transactions without affecting their economies, since the possibility of a direct confrontation remains in the theoretical field only, the West has already been defeated on both fronts: military and economic.

The west has not ties left to cut that would hurt Russia more than it hurts the west... the US ran out of ties first and made the EU cut their ties to try to punish both the EU and Russia... the only remaining ties to cut is energy and that will cripple the EU so that is what the US wants them to do now... the US couldn't care less about Europeans and are only interested in damaging Russia, which is amusing because nothing they can do will damage Russia as much as it will damage themselves and that includes nuclear war.

This special surgery shows one thing quite well. With drones ala TB-2 and with high Support and care, you can annoy the enemy a little. But it is very, very expensive when TorM2 is there. But if you have no AD, especially no TorM2 you are lost.

Very true... many other opponents could not have held the island the way they did because they don't have anything like TOR...

Tor still has a small range against small drones.

It can shoot down ATGMs... its performance against drones that launch weapons should be pretty good with radar and optical systems...

We will see...if they retreat further it's a pushback and a defeat. If they will hold the line and pound the Ukro Nazis as hard as they can it could be a genius move. The line between genius and madness is thin...same applies to defeat or glorious victory.

We will see!

If they stayed in their positions the Orcs could move artillery into the city and fire on them and move around so you either don't hit them or you hit civilian areas of the city. To push into the city you would need thousands more troops and expect to lose troops at a much higher rate too.

By pulling back the enemy will either stay in the city or they will try to advance.

If they advance they move into the ground you occupied so you know where everything is... where the places to take cover are etc etc which you can register for your own artillery. You could also leave behind things for the enemy to find... not explosives... video equipment showing Orc prisoners being treated with respect... documents showing how the war is really going in a way that is demoralising but not giving them anything they could use to hurt you.

If they want to catch up with you and fight then they are out in the open away from their meat shields and away from the defences they have spent time preparing on terrain your artillery has registered for fire... the first rounds could be pamphlets saying drop your weapons and surrender... the next wave of shells not so nice... if you retreat 5km it takes time for people on foot to cover 5km... expecially if you have to retreat 5km as well... attack helicopters can loft 80mm rockets at targets 6-8km away if they are massed troops in the open with a good chance of injuries... not to mention the ground based artillery.

Fun fact...there is no really heavy fighting around Karkov, just a retreat. So maybe can be a trick to lure the Ukro Nazis out of Kharkov. I hope so!!!

In mobile warfare a retreat is where you get forced back by superior forces... a feint is where a superior force pulls back or manouvers in the hopes of drawing the enemy out of well prepared defences into the open where they can clean them up.

Being a Ukrainian air force pilot must be the worst job in the world.

Maybe they are out of test dummies for testing their ejection seats and use humans because they are more gullible in that region.

The problem with withdrawing from Kharkov is that the Ukraine thinks it can win... morale will increase and more and more people will join the fight. In addition, the west will also believe that it can win the war against Russia and deliver more and better weapon systems.

And when the advancing forces are obliterated... far more easily out in the open than possible if they remain inside Kharkov... then what?

I would say that is the most important factor of all....much more important than modern weapons Without morals there is no fight! When morale is high, you fight to the last man, to the last breath

Think you are confusing Morale with moral... I would think the morale in the Russian forces is pretty good... when you are led by nazis and they threaten to put a bullet in the heads of your family if you don't fight then you also fight to the last man too.

and I will tell you will die 98 % and the war is lost...would you fly the sortie?

I would say death rates would be more like 30-40% depending on what hits you... they do have ejection seats you know...

If I tell you your side will win for sure and the chance to die is only 20 %...would you fly? And in both cases the real situation is the same!

Most of the pilots will see the lack of other pilots there and the fact that most planes never come back and work it out for themselves... but some foreign country your country has demonised for the last 30 years is invading your country and you were a trained pilot... would you like a single AK and two mags and a hand grenade and head forward to the trenches... or get into a supersonic plane and play Top Gun for a bit before you eject...

If you compare Taliban with USA, only from technical view and numbers...you would bet not a single Cent on Taliban. Who won?

The US could have said the goal of the mission was to get OBL and so when they got him they could have left the place and declared victory... but the 1% in the US looked at those mountains and all the hidden treasures that have never been mined on an industrial scale... all those riches buried there just waiting to be dug up... and they wanted it.

The poles want to enter west Ukraine just like the US occupied northern Syria. They hope article 5 will discourage the Russians from destroying them. Given the pussyfooting of Russian politicians, that's kind of plausible. The poles will be safe as long as they have some US special forces embedded into their formation. This will make the Russians pussy out just like they pussies out in not bombing attacking Al Tanf and the YPG occupied oil fields.

The Russians have already captured lots of western soldiers in this conflict and don't seem keen on handing back before interrogations.

Polish troops inside the Ukraine near the Polish border are unlikely to get captured by Russian forces... they are more likely to be detected as being well equipped foreign forces that need to be calibrated...

Article 5 does not apply to forces invading another country or even invited there.

US troops are not special... I would think finding out they had killed some US special forces in Ukraine would not upset Russia in the slightest... in the same way the US is not upset if Russians get killed in Syria or Ukraine...

Special forces soldiers understand they are expendible and will take measures not to be hit in the first place... but they know if they die WWIII is not going to start because of that.

All this talk of Russian Generals getting killed in the Ukraine by the west might be to prepare the west when they find out who the Russians capture in various places they have under siege and seem to be desperately trying to free.

I hope what youre saying is true. I'd love to see polish, baltic and lithuanian russophobes seethe over their ground troops getting massacred. But I still have my reservations that russia will do anything other than give a few strong words, and say that it didnt want western ukraine anyway.

If they see contingents of well equipped troops in Ukraine then they will take them out... they have already told HATO it should not be sending weapons or training Orcs... dead HATO soldiers would be HATOs responsibility if they are on Ukrainian territory.

MI6/CIA/NED involvement in sponsoring Nazis in Ukraine goes back decades

The west has been funding nazi groups in the Ukraine since WWII for the specific purpose of undermining first the Soviet Union and now the Russian Federation.

Not much has changed... they still deny they are nazis to the western media, but the symbology and of course the names of the books these idiots read tells the real story...

Prolonged wars are bad and should be avoided . They are bad for the economy , and for morale . A war lasting any longer than a few months or at maximum a year , should be avoided . How much is this war costing , per day ? Per month ? When morale fails , it is then , that bullets reach the bone ! It is then , that irrespective of material superiority , the war is lost . But the war is not lost , as long as morale is high , irrespective of material inferiority .

When wars are for power or control or for oil or rare earth minerals then wars are economic which means long term conflicts make them not worth while... but then you never know how long a war is going to be until you start it.

For Russia there was no alternative to war so it does not matter how long it takes... and how long it takes really comes down to how much shit the Ukrainian people are prepared to take... Kiev can't win, but it can get an almost win by dragging this out... their problem is that this is going to kill all ties between the west and Russia, so in a few years when pipelines go to China and all the gas Russia currently sells to the EU cheaply can go to China cheaply and other countries like India then all ties with the west can be completely cut... the west wont cut them because it would cause them real damage so Russia is going to have to cut them... with other customers they wont care...

Kiev doesn't have enough men to last years... the Russians are grinding them up as are their fellow Ukrainians from the breakaway regions who are sick of promises from Kiev and the west that turn out to be lies and manipulations...

The high up nazis will seep away into the EU with bags of money quietly... if they get the chance of course... there will come a stage where Ukrainian troops will refuse stupid suicidal orders and deal with their leaders they should have dealt with them long ago... but they only seem to care about their own lives and not the civilians they kill every day.

Snipped this out from Ru MOD briefing today, seems Grigorovich class blowing something out of the air.

limb wrote:
How can you say that the russians know combined arms warfare when tanks just get parked by forests without any recon?

How can you question if the Russians know about combined arms warfare, based on the destruction of 1 tank?!
Even more based on a video full of cuts and that doesn't present any context of the situation?

lancelot wrote:
Hungary AFAIK gets all its gas via the Balkan Stream today. Russia -> TurkStream -> Balkan Stream.
It is Slovakia, Czech Republic, and Germany which still get gas via Ukraine.

If true then the more apt statement would be: "someone knows how to squeeze its allies"...

Arrow wrote:The authorities of the Kherson region will appeal to the President of Russia to include the region in the composition of Russia - the head of the military-civil administration of the region.

Bruh, there's a line here. The cheek on these Kherson niggas when DPR/LPR chads are still fighting to regain their territories