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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16

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    Firebird


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    Post  Firebird 20/05/22, 09:04 pm

    My criticism from before 2014 has been this.
    Russia tries to parry the punches, til its worn out. But doesn't punch the aggressor itself.
    Thats sometimes akin to punching a knife rather than a knifer.

    The knifer being the United Snakes and minions. The knife being Bandera-stan.
    So my question is... how does Russia best defend itself against the knifer?

    With 780bases around the World, there is no shortage of targets... and enemies of America to arm/"help in the battle for liberation from Western imperialism".
    But does anyone have an idea what preferred tactics might be?


    Last edited by Firebird on 20/05/22, 09:16 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Podlodka77 20/05/22, 09:08 pm

    In the meantime......

    RIA Novosti

    The dollar fell below 58 rubles for the first time since April 2018
    The dollar exchange rate on the Moscow Exchange fell below 58 rubles for the first time since April 2018


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 31 17868710


    MOSCOW, May 20 - RIA Novosti. The dollar exchange rate on the Moscow Exchange fell to four-year lows, while the euro is also weakening, follows from the trading dynamics.
    Thus, the American currency with settlements "tomorrow" at 10:59 Moscow time fell to 57.85 rubles for the first time since April 2018, and the European currency was trading at the level of 59.97 rubles, which is similar to the rate of April 2017.

    According to analysts, the rate of the Russian currency is affected by the fact that companies are preparing for tax payments on May 25-27, which may create an excess of dollar supply. Russia's unusually strong balance of payments also plays a role.

    https://ria.ru/20220520/kurs-1789661112.html

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    Post  flamming_python 20/05/22, 09:17 pm

    Scorpius wrote:
    The Aerospace Forces of Russia use Su-57 fighters during a military special operation in Ukraine. This was told to TASS by a source in the military-industrial complex. "The use of Su-57 aircraft in Ukraine began two or three weeks after the start of the special operation. The planes operate outside the zone of active destruction by enemy air defense means, using missile weapons," the agency interlocutor said.

    TASS has no official information on this matter.
    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/14679393

    So maybe it's just rumors, but Ukraine is quite suitable as another testing ground for new aircraft. As Georgia has become a combat training ground for the Su-34, Ukraine can become a baptism of fire for the Su-57.

    There was that photo of an unidentified aircraft performing strikes in Western Ukraine early on in the conflict

    And there was another mention of Su-57s being used as well

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    Post  JohninMK 20/05/22, 09:18 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Please Garry, for the nth time, he is NOT allowing Russian military ships (home ported in the Black Sea or not) nor anyone else's military ships through, only his own. He is being totally fair, the only way to do it.

    The rules state that ships that are home ported in the Black Sea can return to port through the straight, which includes Russian ships.

    HATO ships from the US and UK and France are therefore not allowed in because while they are not technically combatants, they don't have home ports in the Black Sea.

    I am well aware that the rules do in deed state that BUT they are not being enforced. I have commented on this from the start and repeat again, home ported military ships are NOT currently being allowed through. Russia saw the benefits of not allowing NATO ships in and specifically agreed to this when the decision was originally made by the Turks.
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    Post  flamming_python 20/05/22, 09:20 pm

    Firebird wrote:My criticism from before 2014 has been this.
    Russia tries to parry the punches, til its worn out. But doesn't punch the aggressor itself.
    Thats sometimes akin to punching a knife rather than a knifer.

    The knifer being the United Snakes and minions. The knife being Bandera-stan.
    So my question is... how does Russia best defend itself against the knifer?

    With 780bases around the World, there is no shortage of targets... and enemies of America to arm/"help in the battle for liberation from Western imperialism".
    But does anyone have an idea what preferred tactics might be?

    Work its way up, that's how

    I agree it's better to not waste time on the henchmen, if they can be avoided

    But the Ukraine couldn't be avoided, and in addition the West went all in on collapsing Russia through the Ukraine. Not just militarily, but diplomatically, economically, by every means. And that leaves them vulnerable in turn. Meanwhile China, India, the UAE, Mexico and other countries are quietly pursuing their own interests and acting to decrease dependence on the West.

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO 20/05/22, 09:21 pm

    Podlodka77 wrote:In the meantime......

    I would not be so happy about that, as too strong RUB is not a good thing either.

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    Post  Podlodka77 20/05/22, 09:22 pm

    TASS; Military operation in Ukraine
    May 20, 11:00 (Updated 11:06)

    Russia has created a headquarters for the restoration of the liberated territories of Ukraine

    Deputy Prime Minister Marat Khusnullin said that the headquarters "included all interested bodies"




    KAZAN, May 20. /TASS/. Work on the restoration of the liberated territories of Ukraine and Donbass, whose infrastructure was damaged during the hostilities, will be carried out in a staff mode. This was stated to journalists on Friday by Deputy Prime Minister of the Russian Federation Marat Khusnullin.

    "We have created a special headquarters, which includes all interested bodies," he said.

    https://tass.ru/ekonomika/14681745

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    Post  JohninMK 20/05/22, 09:23 pm

    Vann7 wrote:taken from another forum..
    but interesting.  

    it shows what is going on with the west barking at Russia.

    Why did you put this post in this thread?

    It should be in the sanctions thread.
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    Post  flamming_python 20/05/22, 09:24 pm

    ALAMO wrote:
    Podlodka77 wrote:In the meantime......

    I would not be so happy about that, as too strong RUB is not a good thing either.

    Yeah

    But sounds like a nice scheme. Get billions of roubles into the budget from rocketing prices for oil/gas while the rouble is weak

    Then strengthen the rouble massively in time for mass debt repayments What a Face

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    Post  Podlodka77 20/05/22, 09:28 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    ALAMO wrote:
    Podlodka77 wrote:In the meantime......

    I would not be so happy about that, as too strong RUB is not a good thing either.

    Yeah

    But sounds like a nice scheme. Get billions of roubles into the budget from rocketing prices for oil/gas while the rouble is weak

    Then strengthen the rouble massively in time for mass debt repayments What a Face

    ALAMO may be partially right, although I think the Russians know what they are doing and will keep the ruble at the rate of about 60 rubles for one dollar. There are big games in question and there will still be a lot of turbulence, especially it seems to me that there will be them in Europe.

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    Post  Erk 20/05/22, 09:33 pm

    Firebird wrote:My criticism from before 2014 has been this.
    Russia tries to parry the punches, til its worn out. But doesn't punch the aggressor itself.
    Thats sometimes akin to punching a knife rather than a knifer.

    The knifer being the United Snakes and minions. The knife being Bandera-stan.
    So my question is... how does Russia best defend itself against the knifer?
    ...
    I think the priority should be to annex all the pro-Russian areas of Ukraine into the Russian Federation.
    Previously I thought having buffer states would be the go, but I changed my mind recently

    Make it so Russia is only surrounded by clearly defined friends or enemies, not fence sitters.

    Nowadays, the US uses proxies to conduct war instead of declaring war itself. NATO is one of those proxies, Ukraine is another.

    So the trick is not to allow the US covert operations in via NGOs, oligarchs, etc. to stir up civil wars, make more proxies, like happened in Ukraine and Syria etc.

    Once Ukraine becomes a Nazi run rump state, clearly defined enemies of Russia, then it gets easier to fight, it's no longer a cancer eating Russian people, but a obvious foe to shoot at.


    Last edited by Erk on 20/05/22, 10:01 pm; edited 3 times in total

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    Post  ALAMO 20/05/22, 09:33 pm

    It is not a case that they don't know, just a fact.
    The currency ratio is not a sign of something being right or wrong.
    Now Russia's current account is flooded with the currency that is being converted. So the ruble will strengthen, as the mass of the conversion is enormous, and now is being made inside the Russian monetary system.

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    Post  Sujoy 20/05/22, 10:11 pm

    Bush asked Zelensky to kill as many Russians possible.

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    Post  franco 20/05/22, 10:23 pm


    Shoigu: 1,908 Ukrainian nationalists from Azovstal have laid down their arms so far... also

    Civilians were evacuated from the territory of the plant, 177 people were rescued, including 85 women and 47 children, the Russian Defense Minister added.

    FULL ARTICLE: https://tvzvezda-ru.translate.goog/news/20225201216-PlsvT.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-GB&_x_tr_pto=nui


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    Post  franco 20/05/22, 10:29 pm


    Shoigu said that more than 1,377,000 people have been evacuated from Ukraine to Russia since the beginning of the special operation

    Sergei Shoigu noted that the RF Armed Forces are doing everything to prevent the death of civilians. Therefore, humanitarian corridors are constantly working in the zone of the special military operation.

    https://tvzvezda-ru.translate.goog/news/20225201218-twM0t.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-GB&_x_tr_pto=nui

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    Post  Isos 20/05/22, 10:32 pm

    Scorpius wrote:
    The Aerospace Forces of Russia use Su-57 fighters during a military special operation in Ukraine. This was told to TASS by a source in the military-industrial complex. "The use of Su-57 aircraft in Ukraine began two or three weeks after the start of the special operation. The planes operate outside the zone of active destruction by enemy air defense means, using missile weapons," the agency interlocutor said.

    TASS has no official information on this matter.
    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/14679393

    So maybe it's just rumors, but Ukraine is quite suitable as another testing ground for new aircraft. As Georgia has become a combat training ground for the Su-34, Ukraine can become a baptism of fire for the Su-57.

    This was captured in a video from march I think. It may be a su-57.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 31 Fnbswl10

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy 20/05/22, 10:34 pm

    Isos wrote:
    This was captured in a video from march I think. It may be a su-57.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 31 Fnbswl10

    Ghost of Kiev? lol1 lol1 lol1







    Tsavo Lion wrote:
    GunshipDemocracy wrote:South-East looks like to be incorporated as a whole to Russia. Lvov and surroundings could be left as a protectorate i.e. Panama...
    no, Poland will take Lvov & W. Ukraine, Hungary & Romania may take their former lands too.
    I've heard that but this happens only if Russia considers it ok for own interests. I dont think that Polish elites are that stupid to get their hand between Russia and its Ukraine.


    Last edited by GunshipDemocracy on 20/05/22, 10:36 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  JohninMK 20/05/22, 10:34 pm

    The plan to lure Ukie troops out of Kharkov and into the region from other places seems to have run its course so now, to prevent them relaxing and repositioning elsewhere, the Russians are starting their counter moves.

    Erik Zimerman
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    6h
    The #Russian counterattack in #Kharkhov aims to cut off Ukrainian troops that advanced too far north and east from the city. It is aiming for the Kharkhov - Staryi Saltiv road (T2014) and to retake a town around Cherkaksi and/or Ruski Tyshky, trapping UA forces north of that all the way to Lyptsi.

    The reason this is possible is because there is a dense forest on the west flank of the Kharkhov - Lyptsi road. The troops could be fully or semi trapped because of this as there are no major, even secondary roads through the forest. Whether troop encirclements are achieved or not, the main goal of the counterattack is much simpler than that.

    If Ukraine believes that it has finished with its Khakrhiv offensive, having reached the border in several places, & can now safely move troops to the critical battle in the Donbass, it is mistaken.

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    Post  GunshipDemocracy 20/05/22, 10:40 pm

    flamming_python wrote:

    Yeah

    But sounds like a nice scheme. Get billions of roubles into the budget from rocketing prices for oil/gas while the rouble is weak

    Then strengthen the rouble massively in time for mass debt repayments What a Face

    what debt repayments ? what debt? no reserves no debt No No No

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    Post  nomadski 20/05/22, 10:50 pm




    Erk wrote " Make it so Russia is only surrounded by clearly defined friends or enemies, not fence sitters. " Funny , I was thinking of the same problem . For sometime , I have felt confused about relations between nations , that are neither at peace , nor direct war , or even direct war . The problem , I faced , was not what to do , in case of direct or indirect war between nations . But what to do , for civilian trade ? My initial idea was that civilian trade should continue , if possible . Only if it helped the civilian sector , politically , against the military industrial sector . But the example of Ukraine , showed in practice , that my thinking may be wrong . A hot and direct war does exemplify a situation , where contradictions between nations , have become existential . This excludes the possibility of civilian trade . But for indirect and smaller wars then civilian trade can continue ?

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    Post  Isos 20/05/22, 10:50 pm

    Ghost of Kiev? 

    Easy to spot the ghost of kiev. Its Stuka siren gives him away.

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    Post  flamming_python 20/05/22, 11:18 pm

    Erk wrote:
    Firebird wrote:My criticism from before 2014 has been this.
    Russia tries to parry the punches, til its worn out. But doesn't punch the aggressor itself.
    Thats sometimes akin to punching a knife rather than a knifer.

    The knifer being the United Snakes and minions. The knife being Bandera-stan.
    So my question is... how does Russia best defend itself against the knifer?
    ...
    I think the priority should be to annex all the pro-Russian areas of Ukraine into the Russian Federation.
    Previously I thought having buffer states would be the go, but I changed my mind recently

    Make it so Russia is only surrounded by clearly defined friends or enemies, not fence sitters.

    Nowadays, the US uses proxies to conduct war instead of declaring war itself. NATO is one of those proxies, Ukraine is another.

    So the trick is not to allow the US covert operations in via NGOs, oligarchs, etc. to stir up civil wars, make more proxies, like happened in Ukraine and Syria etc.

    Once Ukraine becomes a Nazi run rump state, clearly defined enemies of Russia, then it gets easier to fight, it's no longer a cancer eating Russian people, but a obvious foe to shoot at.

    There are no pro-Russian areas in the Ukraine

    What ones there were rebelled already in 2014. Which was the Crimea and the Donbass

    And yes there was a lot of action in places like Kharkov and Odessa, and definitely enough pro-Russian people to support an anti-Maidan authority. If Yanukovich or Russia had acted back in 2014, then it would have been possible to get most of Novorossiya without much trouble. But Russia wouldn't have managed the international heat and sanctions back then.

    But on the whole, if a region requires Russia to take control of it to be pro-Russian, then its not really pro-Russian. Crimea and the Donbass rebelled by themselves. Odessa, Kharkov, Kherson, etc... were all put down. Kherson, this allegedly pro-Russian region - barely had an anti-Maidan movement at all.
    A NY Times op-ed focusing on Melitopol quoted someone as saying that if Russia had come in 2014 then it would have been greeted with open arms. But now for supporting 'seperatism' and violence in the east most people are against it. In other words people in Melitopol if the source is to be believed, willingly accepted Ukrainian nationalist propaganda that turns reality upside down. And one can hardly call such people pro-Russian.
    Added to that is the fact that since 2014 a lot of anti-Maidan activists were killed, jailed or fled the country. A lot of people even with just some pro-Russian views left, as the atmosphere became alien to them.

    And now the same Kherson region, at least in Kherson city itself - has more pro-Ukrs than pro-Russians. Maybe most people are mildly indifferent, or mildly pro-Ukr.
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    Post  franco 20/05/22, 11:26 pm

    There were reports that not all the Azov's at Mariupol wanted to surrender, this was apparently within the last 2 hours. Confirmation will be needed:

    https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1527569462156738560

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    Post  Hole 20/05/22, 11:41 pm

    JohninMK wrote:The plan to lure Ukie troops out of Kharkov and into the region from other places seems to have run its course so now, to prevent them relaxing and repositioning elsewhere, the Russians are starting their counter moves.

    Erik Zimerman
    @ZimermanErik
    ·
    6h
    The #Russian counterattack in #Kharkhov aims to cut off Ukrainian troops that advanced too far north and east from the city. It is aiming for the Kharkhov - Staryi Saltiv road (T2014) and to retake a town around Cherkaksi and/or Ruski Tyshky, trapping UA forces north of that all the way to Lyptsi.

    The reason this is possible is because there is a dense forest on the west flank of the Kharkhov - Lyptsi road. The troops could be fully or semi trapped because of this as there are no major, even secondary roads through the forest. Whether troop encirclements are achieved or not, the main goal of the counterattack is much simpler than that.

    If Ukraine believes that it has finished with its Khakrhiv offensive, having reached the border in several places, & can now safely move troops to the critical battle in the Donbass, it is mistaken.

    Since when can "Ukraine" move troops safely? Very Happy

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    Post  Hole 20/05/22, 11:42 pm

    ALAMO wrote:Aside from a discussion.
    There are more and more films revealed, where detachments deny performing duties, claiming lack of a weapon, support, orders, disrupted chain of command, fleeing officers etc.
    Along with that, more and more documents with family members claiming the same, occupying the regime buildings, bullying local command officers about the fate of family members etc.

    That is a deja vu.

    It was already in the script, back in 2015, after the Dobalcevo and Ilovaysk. Just the same story repeats itself.

    An official call from the Snuffy office about mobilization targeting the western - more "loyal" parts of Ukropistan is just another point on the list.

    We can bet if that all shit will stand to repeat August 2015 ...

    That´s why the internet is still running in "Ukraine".

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