Prigozhin mutiny thread

Hole wrote:https://sonar21.com/russias-academy-award-winning-performance-for-best-coup-prigozhin-scores-best-actor/
Larry Johnson thinks it was a maskirovka to move troops around.

They allowed terrorists to kill their pilots just to move troops around?

Hole wrote:*I don't buy the fact that a trusted ally of Putin, who fought against the collective West turns overnight against his own country.

That "ally" offered to sell positions of Russian Army to Ukraine

Hole wrote:*I don't buy that Putin would just let a traitor leave like this without strong punishment/death

And yet that's exactly what he did

Hole wrote:Putin is just way too smart to have allowed this to happen.

Putin was exposed as retard with his Kiev invasion plan and when he allowed armed convicts to supplant military

Well, half of the US marine core are former convicts. I remember when I was dealing with Canadian convicts who were hired to join the US Marines. So it wasn't just Americans either.

Also, the supposed Prigohzin selling locations of Russian forces to Ukraine wasn't actually proven either and vehemently denied by Wagner. Without proof, it becomes speculation.

Anyway, this whole charade wasn't a 4D chess move. And I honestly think the families of the lost should sue both the government and Prigohzin and shed light on the situation. Maybe enough exposure will force the Russians to make sure Prigohzin and the Wagner units responsible, to face punishment. We also get to know the names of the dead so we actually know if this happened or not.

Also, how was it that Wagner obtained advanced AD systems not in Ukraine but in Russia?

Apparently Prigohzin claims that shooting the plane down was in error (?) and he will pay 50 (?) million to the families.

Again Wagner has been Largely neutered, after what they did and yes they did it, Putin will not allow them to exist in any real capacity, most will.be absorbed into the Russian army, those that don't will retire, and few will go with their boss

Regardless Wagner's days are over

franco wrote:Apparently Prigohzin claims that shooting the plane down was in error (?) and he will pay 50 (?) million to the families.

Fùcking criminal thug through and through

In error over Russia? How stupid does he think people are? (then again this is Russia, stupid is the norm apparently)

SeigSoloyvov wrote:Again Wagner has been Largely neutered, after what they did and yes they did it, Putin will not allow them to exist in any real capacity, most will.be absorbed into the Russian army, those that don't will retire, and few will go with their boss

Regardless Wagner's days are over

They got away with everything, they are just getting started

Disappearing them quietly is the opposite of what should be done

They openly started armed insurrection, they should be exterminated openly

Otherwise they are just proving that country is weak and corrupt

flamming_python wrote:That story about the plane being shot down doesn't make much sense

And why would Wagner have air defence systems like the Pantsir? These require a whole infastructure, and highly-trained specialists. And why would these people obey some mutineer's orders?

Again I don't buy this version.

They had at least two pantsirs filmed in Rostov. Not to mention whole squads of Igla and Strela-10M

This interview happened before the conclusion

PapaDragon wrote:
Disappearing them quietly is the opposite of what should be done

They openly started armed insurrection, they should be exterminated openly

Otherwise they are just proving that country is weak and corrupt

So far it looks like the lunatic retards show will go on. He's eventually going to do some kind of interview and will be his usual self. He should be arrested and shot in 1 day. Just like Ceaușescu.

Yevgeny Prigozhin is not yet in touch and sends his regards to everyone, RTVI was told in the press service of the creator of the Wagner PMC.

“He says hello to everyone and will answer questions when he is on normal communication,” the journalist was told in response to a request.

So he isn't the creator of Wagner, but it was some in GRU and Prigohzin is the face of it due to his rather strong suite in charisma.



It's more likely that it was a bit of him and GRU agent.

Sad day to witness . Russia being downgraded to a level of CAR (Central African Republic) or any other banana republic, where PMCs are executing coups and government takeovers. While getting to live next day and leave unharmed.
Eternal memory to pilots and other military men that died.
Whoever claims that Wagner didn't have or couldn't operate Pantsir, a reminder that they've been using them since Libya and yesterday two were recorded in their columns. Not to mention, numerous Igla operators and also Strela-10 system that tried to shoot down Ka-52 in Voronezh. So far, Il-22, Ka-52 and one Mi-8 were confirmed via video proof. There's no reason to assume that other 3 claimed Mi-8 and Mi-35 weren't shot down.
If it makes some members cope easier than to look the truth in the eye, then anything goes.

It is a high time for Russian government to completely overhaul and cleanse security structures, as it is clear that current system has many flaws.

@sepheronx
Creator of Wagner is Dmitry Utkin, ex-GRU colonel with very "colourful" past and views. He used call name Wagner in Donbass.

caveat emptor wrote:Sad day to witness . Russia being downgraded to a level of CAR (Central African Republic) or any other banana republic, where PMCs are executing coups and government takeovers. While getting to live next day and leave unharmed.
Eternal memory to pilots and other military men that died.
Whoever claims that Wagner didn't have or couldn't operate Pantsir, a reminder that they've been using them since Libya and yesterday two were recorded in their columns. Not to mention, numerous Igla operators and also Strela-10 system that tried to shoot down Ka-52 in Voronezh. So far, Il-22, Ka-52 and one Mi-8 were confirmed via video proof. There's no reason to assume that other 3 claimed Mi-8 and Mi-35 weren't shot down.
If it makes some members cope easier than to look the truth in the eye, then anything goes.

It is a high time for Russian government to completely overhaul and cleanse security structures, as it is clear that current system has many flaws.

@sepheronx
Creator of Wagner is Dmitry Utkin, ex-GRU colonel with very "colourful" past and views. He used  call name Wagner in Donbass.

Thanks for the info on GRU guy.  Yeah, there will need to be a massive clean up in Russia security structure. And I do believe that Rosgvardi needs an overhaul and drastic increase in numbers and fighting capabilities.

So it's presumed that Prigohzin will have to move to Africa in order to lead the mercs there as per agreement.

Mercouris is right on target with his analysis. Prigozhin's coup attempt is clearly coordinated with NATzO. In fact, it is predicated
on the slew of NATzO BS about the state of Russia's army and the war. Prigozhin also outed himself as a NATzO bootlick by parroting
the BS narratives about the recent history of the Donbass.

kvs wrote:Mercouris is right on target with his analysis.   Prigozhin's coup attempt is clearly coordinated with NATzO.  In fact, it is predicated
on the slew of NATzO BS about the state of Russia's army and the war.    Prigozhin also outed himself as a NATzO bootlick by parroting
the BS narratives about the recent history of the Donbass.

Yeah. And their central target since the beginning was Shoigu and a lesser extent Garisimov. I can only hope and assume that it was less effective in the Russian speaking Internet than the English one. Because it sure spread like wildfire in the English Internet. Every Telegram bro and their dog had it out for Shoigu. And some of these dupes still think it is a thing.

kvs wrote:Mercouris is right on target with his analysis.   Prigozhin's coup attempt is clearly coordinated with NATzO.  In fact, it is predicated
on the slew of NATzO BS about the state of Russia's army and the war.    Prigozhin also outed himself as a NATzO bootlick by parroting
the BS narratives about the recent history of the Donbass.

I would agree if there were any reprecautions for him especially in todays times were being a 5th column is treason and a good reason to be vaporized without any trial or court.

The shit show right now was 24h rapid developement with only the West being "OHH MAH GOD, Russia is imploding".
In Russia there was confusion and the common housewives idiots with to much time on their hands causing hysteria in their group chats and amongst friends and relatives. Other than that I am still waiting for actual evidence for either side.

To me it looks like staged maskirovka but a very dramatic one and risky one in terms of reputation and people who are not 100% included into the coup de' expose de' quinto colonna.

Pro Maskirovka
-No, hard facts of dead.
-A helicopter that was standing in a field and burning, while most of the time Mi-8 which gets shot down usually smashes into the ground and collapses the crew compartment from it's own weight and the kinetic energy.
-Commical display in the city of "force" by just being there like a John Travolta meme while people continue their lives
- No actual seizing of anything by Wagner
- Strela 10 shooting against a Ka-52 which has proven to handle 15 incoming Manpads in short period of time (agree risky show of for pretended coup)
- One air plane on video, which has no other footage of the wreck or human remains.
- Speeded up court case against Prigozhin and immediate drop of the case (unlawful by Russian laws) That never existed before
- ON same day of "coup" he relocates to Belarus at the same time when Poland has relocation of forces.
- Current frontal situation obliterates Ukro offensives
- Prigozhin's display of acting resulted constantly in progress on the front and dead Ukros
- In geopolitical terms - turn western Propaganda by 180° and you will be closer to the truth (always)

-Con Maskirovka
- If there are any dead by either aircraft it is a criminal use of western technology and "false flag" attempts
- Reputation decrease
- Uncertainity of reaction by people not fully involved and with fullknowledge of the coup
- reaction of 5th columnists sabotaging, killing and provoking pogroms and all the mayhem that they want to cause
- Since all the time the West has actors Ukro and Russian side actors that are involved in sabotage even within military complexes.

Right now, in all objectivity is to early to say the entire reprecautions that this will have for Prigozhin, Putin or Russia. From the information I have I think it is much more likely, that this was some sort of very risky Maskirovka. The possible 5th columnists which might have exposed we will not know immediately and that probably has some FSB reasons not to tell the enemy that their "assets" have been "neutralized"

Such assets are usually used in waves to have Plan A,B,C...whatever.
I think we only will find out a little bit more without the fog of diception and maskirovka in a few months.

Right now, I see movements of units and by the end of the year we will see proxy involvement of Polish fighters under Ukro insignia on Belarus. That is what I expect. The already Ukrops under "Russian flag" trying to "raid" Belgorod and getting flamed up was a trial and error.

Anyways, I will continue to observe and make my judgement later on. Right now to much propaganda from all sides and our very own Maskirovka shit information is distorting the whole picture.

My personal biased guess is, we are much closer to Belarus and Russia unification than I personally was expecting in 5-15 years from now. I think we are much closer than previously expected. But I am speculating on terms of soley political moves, while real world Belarussians are somewhere 50/50 on that matter. Either they make a big jerk in terms of political push against Belarus where Belarussians would feel part of the war then they might as well become majority in favor of Russia.

Anyways, time has and will always be master of wisdom.
-

The voiceover is really funny  

Apparently some photos/video



Il-22VPU of the Russian Aerospace Forces shot down by Wagner.

https://twitter.com/Sprinter99880/status/1673042043327639558?cxt=HHwWjMCz7fm367cuAAAA

Another theory:

After the dust started to settle and the noise faded let me give you my view.

Prigozin tried to size power.

He prepared for this for months. He lied about the amount of ammo provided so he can stockpile for his coup.

He waited for the offensive to start, so the Russian army is focused on stopping the enemy. Then he struck.

He spread the news that the Russian army is collapsing - because that is what he wanted, a retreating Russian army and a nation looking for some one to blame.

If the defensive lines would of have broken the usual doomers would all have been outraged, and many people would have been looking for someone responsible, like last autumn.

In that situation, Prigozin would step in and lead his Wagner "heroes" to stabilize the nation.
A saviour. A man that rescues the day.

But the Russian army held. As the Ukrainian hordes struck, the Russians fought, dug in, and refused to retreat or break. The airforce worked around the clock. The intelligence was good and high ranking Russian generals were in the forward observation posts exactly where the Ukrainians attacked, commanding the battle and the defense.
Russian reinforcements were ready, they countered where needed and the Ukrainains were smashed. Again and again.

So why start a coup?

Pregozin was already committed. He was afraid of leaks from his people, he was afraid the Russian FSB would smell him out. So he had to move. He had to start his grotesquerie. He struck at the precise moment when all the defenders of the motgerland were holding back the enemy. Behind their backs.

He made that fake video. Some stupid trampled forest that was supposed to be a missile strike, but the forest was green and not scorched. Another missile strike was presented, but the crater was not round, but a square. With 2 fires lit up at the bottom of the square. It convinced almost no one.

But at this point there was no turning back for Prigozin.

He spread the information about a pogrom on the front lines. that the Russian army had lost enormous territory that the Ukrainians were advancing and winning. That the truth is being hidden from the Russian people - a disaster was happening!

We were confused, we could not understand why he would say things like this. Some believed he is just emotional, some that he has PTSD, but the viper was working according to his plan. He struck . His men were already in the back of the RUssian army, they moved to size the Russian command center in Rostov-on-Don and the airfields. Then they moved north to Moscow. Fast.
Wagner has done this many times in Africa. Size power, move quickly, take key objectives under your control. overrun the capital. Have government people and institutions join your side.

But no one rallied to Pregozin's cause. The millitary refused to side with him. Unit after unit repudiated what he was doing. The police in Rostov refused to go on his side. The governors of the regions did not join his side. The intel services refused to participate in this. The politicians refused to side with the snake.
Kadirov refused to support him and instead sent units to retake Rostov by force if need be.
Not one opposition party joined the coup.

Without any support Prigozin played his last card. No more violence in exchange for the safety of his skin.

He would call Wagner off if his hide is protected. That is whom Pregozin is. He was not emotional or with PTSD or had a beef with one or another russian general.

He is just a greedy and powerhungry villain.




Yuliana Dlugaj (Twitter user)

So the videos about not having ammunition were just a ploy to stockpile ammunition for his insurrection. So Shoigu wasn't in fact , denying Wagner ammunition. It was all a fraud. And the Telegram bros fell for it.

Just imagine Prigozin was smart and not a complete retard. He could have made videos that were far less provocative. Or used back channels to get ammo.

Shoigu is a bit too much like Putin. He was too diplomatic in dealing with this piece of shit. He should have had Prigozhin killed or captured. He should have ordered it personally.