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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9

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    etaepsilonk


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    Post  etaepsilonk Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:58 pm

    Comment educator educating comment educator about comment educating. Priceless.
    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi Tue Oct 07, 2014 1:03 pm

    arpakola wrote:


    Systematic brainwashing from the very young age... partly explains why some of our friends have a very wrong image of Stepan Badera.

    May be it is Off Topic but this reminds me about a good number of Cambodians today do not know that Pol Pot regime was evil...
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    Post  gregoire Tue Oct 07, 2014 2:46 pm

    etaepsilonk wrote:Comment educator educating comment educator about comment educating. Priceless.

    Meaningless.
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    Post  Vann7 Tue Oct 07, 2014 7:38 pm



    THe brainwashing of young generations and rewriting of Ukraine History is not new..That have always be the policy of Europe since early in the century in the 1900s when Ukraine did not existed ,germans were brainwashing Ukrainians to turn them against Russia.. basically the idea was to create a major buffer zone inside Russia empire to halt Russia expansion.. everyone in europe saw as a major threat the size of Russia empire and perceived that if they do nothing to halt their influence... that Russia could end taking all europe. Today that policy still exist. This is why they target children and young people.. they are the ones more vulnerables to bullshit and lies.. you can tell anything to a children and they will believe it.
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    Post  arpakola Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:00 am

    http://www.1tv.ru/news/world/269261







    ====================
    Is Kiev Wildly Understating Combat Deaths?

    http://www.thesaker.net/russia/is-kiev-wildly-understating-combat-deaths/
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    Post  arpakola Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:43 am



    =========================

    arpakola
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    Post  arpakola Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:22 am

    Is Kiev Wildly Understating Combat Deaths?
    Last month on his Facebook page Lyashko directly accused President Petro Poroshenko of hiding over 8,000 Ukrainian combat deaths -- a number nearly eight times the ‘official’ KIA figures reported by the English-language Kyiv Post, which as of Friday was still stubbornly reporting ‘only’ 974 confirmed Ukrainian combat deaths - a highly dubious figure that has barely budged since the disastrous battle for Ilovaisk in early September.
    http://russia-insider.com/en/military_politics_ukraine_opinion_media_watch/2014/10/08/08-18-26am/kiev_wildly_understating_combat
    Is Kiev Wildly Understating Combat Deaths?

    ======================
    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Logo-v-3
    http://russia-insider.com/en/tv_politics_ukraine_christianity/2014/10/07/09-10-46am/eu_demands_russia_return_kiev_pow_listen_what
    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 22let


    EU Demands Russia Return This Kiev POW. Listen to What She Did





    Last edited by arpakola on Wed Oct 08, 2014 12:44 pm; edited 2 times in total
    Morpheus Eberhardt
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Empty Novorossiya Sitrep 07/10/14

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt Wed Oct 08, 2014 12:14 pm

    Novorossiya sitrep 07/10/14

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 DVt3KcY
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    Post  arpakola Wed Oct 08, 2014 1:30 pm

    http://russia-insider.com/en/ukraine_business/2014/10/08/08-19-42am/ukraine_wests_next_fracking_victim
    Ukraine: The West's Next Fracking Victim
    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Fracking-ukraine-shale-gas-map
    the goal of private companies is profits - not their host country’s energy independence
    US interest in Ukraine’s energy resources, a subject that has gone almost unreported but which we have discussed previously, carries on unabated.

    Last week Petro Poroshenko, Ukraine’s President, voiced hopes for cooperation with the US in shale gas development. And during her trip to Kiev, US Commerce Secretary Penny Pritzker said the US would assist Ukraine in developing its energy sector.

    The key problem however remains as before.  For an oil and gas industry, having the main fields stuck in a war zone just about tops the list of worst-case scenarios.

    The two biggest investors in Ukrainian energy remain Royal Dutch Shell and Chevron. Shell has a hydrocarbons production-sharing agreement with the Ukrainian government at the Yuzivska field, which lies across Donetsk and Kharkiv regions of Ukraine, slap in the middle of the war zone.  As a result Shell has been forced to put shale projects on hold since February 2014.  Chevron was luckier, having signed a shale gas production-sharing agreement for the Olesska field, which is in western Ukraine and therefore has been unaffected by the conflict so far.

    All this is happening under the slogan of reducing energy dependence on Russia. Supposedly the American shale gas revolution model will help Ukraine achieve that. The US State department acts as the main promoter of shale gas, selecting countries and “helping them understand” their shale gas potential. This noble mission, also supposedly aimed at reducing CO2 emissions, is called Unconventional Gas Technical Engagement Program (UGTEP).

    According to the US Energy Information Administration, Ukraine has Europe’s third-largest shale gas reserves at 42 trillion cubic feet.  Shell and Chevron are supposed to help Ukraine double its natural gas output.

    Meanwhile, apart from controversy over its environmental impact, shale gas development stirs substantiated concerns about the price to be paid for achieving the promised "energy security". The reality of shale gas development is uncertain because of the difficulty of accurately assessing both resources and future achievable output.  Already there are fears that expectations of a shale gas bonanza for Ukraine may be overly-optimistic.  Technical problems are also coming to the fore.  Shell is finding that local products are incompatible with its own equipment.

    As for the role of western energy companies and their US backers, it is interesting how shale gas missionaries seem to turn up at the right place, at the right time, in ways that ultimately suit themselves.  Perhaps Ukrainians might care to remember that the goal of private companies is profits - not their host country’s energy independence.  

    http://www.dangersoffracking.com/

    http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/8/10/long-before-the-fearofwartherewasfearoffrackinginukraine.html


    Last edited by arpakola on Wed Oct 08, 2014 5:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi Wed Oct 08, 2014 3:08 pm

    All this is happening under the slogan of reducing energy dependence on Russia.

    Oh yeah, reduce dependence on Russia and then increase dependence on the West. Rolling Eyes

    Perhaps Ukrainians might care to remember that the goal of private companies is profits - not their host country’s energy independence.  

    Ukrainian people may care, but Ukrainian oligarchs do not care. They care about their own money. Rolling Eyes

    Anyway, Ukrainian Defense Minister has just claimed that Russia is testing the new kind of tungsten carbide armour-piercing round with level of armour-piercing at 7N37. Kyiv claimed that they have no armour which can withstand such ammunition.
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Oct 08, 2014 4:28 pm

    http://en.itar-tass.com/world/753326

    Hmm, so the UN is ignoring the mass graves in Ukraine. Sounds to me like Modi was correct about current UN at his speach...
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    Post  Hannibal Barca Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:08 pm

    Do we gain anything as of late?
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Wed Oct 08, 2014 8:24 pm

    sepheronx wrote:http://en.itar-tass.com/world/753326

    Hmm, so the UN is ignoring the mass graves in Ukraine. Sounds to me like Modi was correct about current UN at his speach...

    The fact that India is not in the permanent member security council is a travesty in it's self.
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    Post  kvs Wed Oct 08, 2014 9:14 pm

    http://en.itar-tass.com/world/753294

    Very peculiar. I wonder what conditions these "UN monitors" demanded from the rebels? Like total security from regime shelling?
    An obvious ploy to bury this story and cover their lying paid a**es at the same time.

    If you recall we had the same song and dance over access to the MH17 crash site. Somehow the OSCE showed up on site
    in a couple of days, but crash investigators were stuck in Kiev because the regime "could not assure their safety".

    Nothing can be taken at face value these days.
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    Post  kvs Wed Oct 08, 2014 9:14 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:http://en.itar-tass.com/world/753326

    Hmm, so the UN is ignoring the mass graves in Ukraine. Sounds to me like Modi was correct about current UN at his speach...

    The fact that India is not in the permanent member security council is a travesty in it's self.

    I agree. After the collapse of the USSR, the UN has become a NATO rubber stamp.
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    Post  Mike E Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:59 pm

    http://en.ria.ru/world/20141008/193825007/US-Might-Eventually-Provide-Lethal-Military-Aid-to-Ukraine.html - Not like they haven't already supplied weapons... Cough...Javelin....Cough 

    It is *so* hypocritical that the US has and will be supplying lethal weapons to Ukraine, and yet the condemn Russia for doing the same for Novorossiya. Might have to "hit up" our government in DC if you get what I mean (just made the NSA top 10 watch-list!)
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    Post  higurashihougi Thu Oct 09, 2014 10:07 am

    kvs wrote:I agree. After the collapse of the USSR, the UN has become a NATO rubber stamp.

    Beijing and Moskva still have two pernament seat in the UNSC, so there is still a good counter against the West's power.

    Mike E wrote:http://en.ria.ru/world/20141008/193825007/US-Might-Eventually-Provide-Lethal-Military-Aid-to-Ukraine.html - Not like they haven't already supplied weapons... Cough...Javelin....Cough 

    It is *so* hypocritical that the US has and will be supplying lethal weapons to Ukraine, and yet the condemn Russia for doing the same for Novorossiya. Might have to "hit up" our government in DC if you get what I mean (just made the NSA top 10 watch-list!)

    It is the U.S. had supplied weapons to Taliban, Bin Laden, took a blind eye at Khmer Rouge and ISIL.

    It is the West who took a blind eye to Hitler when he was rising to power.

    I don't know what is the thinking of the Western oligarchs, but I would like to have a great rival rather than have an alliance with the scums.
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    Post  arpakola Thu Oct 09, 2014 11:17 am

    http://www.thesaker.net/
    Ukraine SITREP October 8th, 16:00 UTC/Zulu: The calm before the storm?
    Military situation

    The situation in the Ukraine and Novorussia is a very tense and could lead to a major resumption of hostilities.

    The Junta Repression Forces (JRF) have used the ceasefire to lick their wounds, get reorganized, concentrate their forces, bring in much needed reinforcements, prepare defensive fortifications and bring in new units. The Novorussian Armed Forces (NAF) have done the same but, unlike the JRF, the NAF suffer from a lack of equipment, possibly made worse by a reduction of the flow of weapons, in particular heavy ones, from Russia (the so-called voentorg). In terms of personnel, the influx of volunteers to the NDF has remained steady and strong.

    Why did Moscow turn down the air-spigot to Novorussia?

    There could be a number of reasons, but the three main one are probably:

    1. A way to put pressure on the Novorussian leadership to abide by the ceasefire and to remind them that they cannot ignore the Kremlin's position.
    2. To deny the AngloZionists any possibility to find some proof of the voentorg.
    3. To show the Europeans that "see - we are upholding our end of the deal while the Junta does not"

    The latter is absolutely true, by the way.

    Even though the Donetsk airport has finally been taken (I define "taken" not as "every Ukie killed" but as "every Ukie artillery system destroyed" because this is what matters for Donetsk), the JRF is still shelling the city the north, the west and southwest. Furthermore, there are some very ominous signs that the JRF is preparing to try to encircle Gorlovka.



    October 7th combat map
    In the meanwhile the NAF has pulled back the units which had gone as far as the north and even west of Mariupol and the "southern front" has now acquired a much more defensible shape as shown by the latest map (click here for a high-resolution version).

    The frontline has not moved much during the ceasefire. The NAF has made some local advances, the JRF has retreated in certain locations, but by and large the line of contact has remained unchanged and it being used as a basis for the development of a disengagement plan prepared by Ukrainian, OSCE, Novorussian and Russian experts. Indeed, there are officially 80 Russian General Staff officers currently in the Donbass (invited by Kiev) who are participating in the development of the planned "buffer zone" between both sides. This fact is, in itself, rather interesting as it now shows that the US, EU, OSCE and the Junta had to give up on their long-standing claim that the Russians had no say or status in an "internal and sovereign Ukrainian process".

    Another very interesting development has been the offer of President Lukashenko of Belarus to send in peacekeepers which the Novorussian authorities immediately accepted. So far, this is not officially on the table, but the offer is interesting for the following reasons:

    1. The Belarussians have an extremely powerful military, well-trained and well-equipped and they would be a very robust and tough peacekeeping force.
    2. The Belarussians armed forces are extremely close to the Russian armed forces and, for all practical purposes, they are one entity. Thus both the Novorussians and Russians could trust the Belarussians.
    3. While Lukashenko is somewhat of a goofball who regularly makes bizarre and contradictory statements, he is also a smart man who knows the score and who will remain loyal to Russia and the CSTO.

    In other words, bringing in the Belarussians - even as peacekeepers - could well mean the end of any Ukie hopes to re-conquer the Donbass. This, however, also could mean the end of any Novorussian hopes of liberating the Junta-occupied Novorussia.

    Will the ceasefire hold?

    I don't know, but I am confident that the Novorussians will not break it first. Most of them absolutely hate this ceasefire, but they also understand that there are bigger political issues involved and that they cannot simply defy Moscow. As for the Kremlin, its position appears to be that "Plan A" is to make the most of the ceasefire and "Plan B" is to make sure that the Ukies carry the full political responsibility for a resumption of full-scale hostilities.

    Parsing the Russian media (corporate and social) I would say that:

    1. There is a very large consensus in Russia that the Novorussians have earned the right to be free from Kiev. Of course, many (most?) Russians do understand that Novorussia might have to remain formally part of a unitary Ukraine, but only formally, not in any meaningful way, and only temporarily. A good example of his understanding is this blogger's analysis (see here machine translated by Google).
    2. Nobody in Russia trusts the junta or Poroshenko. There is a consensus that the only way to keep Novorussia safe is to have it militarily strong enough to beat back any possible Ukrainian attack.
    3. The Dugin-Limonov camp has lost the PR war and very few people still make the case for an overt Russian military intervention. However, this might very rapidly change of the JRF break the ceasefire and attack.
    4. The CIA-backed "liberal" (in the Russian sense) camp is in total disarray. Except for the TV channel Dozhd or the Ekho Moskvy Radio station, nobody takes them seriously and when one of their representatives shows up on a TV show they get eviscerated in minutes by all the other guests and even the show host.

    From all this I conclude that Russia is "ready to pounce": if the Ukies break the ceasefire and massively attack, the "voentorg-spigot" will reopen immediately and freely flow, if the Ukies are successful and if the NAF proves unable to withstand the assault, Russia will directly intervene again like she did in August. If Novorussia is truly threatened, Putin will openly send in the Russian military (though he would do that only if given no other options at all).

    Political situation: Banderastan

    The situation in Junta-occupied Ukraine (aka "Banderastan") is one of complete chaos. Violence (political and criminal) is everywhere and the state has more or less ceased to function. Take for example the numerous destructions of the statue of Lenin. First, the fact that they are being destroyed to begin with is a telling example of the Ukie ignorance of history since it was Lenin which created the Ukraine as a state, Stalin which added the western Ukraine, and Krushchev which gave the Ukies Crimea. So they can continue to go on repeating their slogan "Комуняку на гілляку" ("commies on branches" meaning that Communists should be hanged), but the modern Ukraine is a 100% commie-made entity (besides, Lenin was a vicious russophobe who hated everything Russian with a passion). But the main point is that the destruction of these statues shows that law and order are gone and the mob rule is really the only "authority left".

    Second, while there are clans who fight each other inside the junta (Poroshenko vs Kolomoiski vs Liashko vs Iarosh vs Tymoshenko etc.) there is no real opposition left. Well, I guess you could say that there is almost no real opposition left.



    Elena Bondarenko
    Following the brutal assault on Rada Deputy Nestor Shufrich (who is now in the hospital), the last two more or less well-known opposition figures are Elena Bondarenko and Nikolai Levchenko, both, like Shufrich, from the Party of Regions. Bondarenko was openly threatened by the Minister of Internal Affairs who actually said on Ukie TV the following: "when I hear speak my hand goes to my gun". These are the words of the top law enforcement official in Bandestan!

    To be honest, I am very concerned for her personal safety and since she has refused to participate in the upcoming farce of the Ukie elections, she should probably find refuge in Russia or Crimea as her life is most definitely at risk.



    Nikolai Levchenko
    The other high profile opposition figure is Nikolai Levchenko, also a Party of Regions Deputy who is often associated with the oligarch Rinat Akhmetov. Levchenko, who was elected in the Donbass, is particularly hated by many Novorussian field commanders because he opposes both the JRF and the NAF and because he often compares the two sides. Whether Levchenko truly believes that armed resistance only makes things worse or whether he speaks for the financial interests of Rinat Akhmetov is anybody's guess. All I can say is that he did openly oppose the neo-Nazi junta in the Rada and that he was assaulted and beaten up for it. Bondakeno also dared to openly challenge the Ukies junta during her speeches in the Rada and was forcibly removed from the podium but not beaten up (yet?).

    It is important to stress here that both Bondarenko and Levchenko are loyal Ukrainians - they not only put some of the blame for the violence on the Novorussians, they also reject the return of Crimea to Russia which they blame on the crazy policies of Kiev. If the West had had any decency (or brains for that matter), these are the people it should have supported, but now it is way too late and people like Bondarenko and Levchenko have simply lost their constituency which not only rejects their "moderate" stance but which now considers itself as having left the Ukraine and thus not concerned by elections to the Rada.

    As far as I know, neither Levchenko nor Bondarenko are running in the next "election" since they both consider it a total farce (and, besides, since the Donbass won't participate in this election anyway, what would be the point?). As for the Ukrainian Communist Party, it has basically gone underground, with many of its members assaulted, murdered and threatened. The sad but undeniable reality is that there is no opposition in Banderstan, only various clans and various flavors combining neo-Nazi and oligarchic interests.

    Banderastan thus has no political future to speak of. But then, neither does it have an economic, cultural, social or any other kind of future. The only question now is whether it will resemble more Haiti, Somalia or Iraq. The only certain thing about the future now is that coming winter will be terrible and violent.

    Political situation: Novorussia

    The infighting of Novorussian political leaders and field commanders continues. At best, some of them simply ignore everybody else (Khodakovski or Cossack leaders) at worst, they openly fight each other (Bezler and Zakharchenko). In fact, Zakharchenko apparently resigned, then this resignation was pulled back.

    Why is this infighting continuing?

    There are several reasons for that:

    1) The ceasefire agreement is extremely controversial and while nobody likes it in Novorussia, the degree of opposition to it differs from person to person.
    2) Even though Strelkov tried really hard to turn an insurgency of volunteer militiamen into a regular army he was not given enough time and while the purely military coordination has improved (reportedly with Russian General Staff specialists), the political unity is still lacking.
    3) There are also upcoming elections in Novorussia and some politicians (Zakharchenko, Gubarev) feel that they must take a politically correct stance.
    4) The fact that Russian and Novorussians objective interests are not one and the same also exacerbates the issue of who will get Russian help.
    5) Some Novorussian military field commanders (Mozgovoi?) feel that this entire political circus is useless and that Novorussia should be run by those who liberated it: the military. Obviously, civilian politicians don't care for this kind of vision.
    6) The Russian infighting between the "Atlantic Integrationists" and "Eurasian Sovereignists" is having a spillover effect into Novorussia.

    As a result of all this, I would say that Novorussia is solid in military terms and weak in political terms. Furthermore, contrary to what I had expected, Strelkov has not had much of an impact on the Russian political scene and, at least so far, has been relatively recluse. I have no explanation for that.

    Conclusion:

    On one hand, the ceasefire is being constantly and increasingly violated. A major Ukie attack is definitely possible. On the the other hand, the work on the creation of a buffer zone, possibly involving foreign troops, is actively being pursued and the conflict could temporarily be frozen along the current line of contact. Both Banderastan and Novorussia are politically weak and neither is truly under the authority of one single person or group of people. The following months will be catastrophic for the Nazi-occupied Ukraine and quite literally anything is possible there including a 3rd Maidan, a coup, local insurrections, false flag operations, assassinations and, of course, war. In a way, the stupid trench-to-become-wall the Ukies are building along the borders with Novorussia, Russia and Transnistria might end up protecting Banderastan's neighbors from the effects of the explosion to come.

    The Saker
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Empty Novorossiya Sitrep 08/10/14

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:33 pm

    Novorossiya sitrep 08/10/14

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Www6n2H
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    Post  arpakola Thu Oct 09, 2014 1:09 pm

    SLAVA UKRAINA
    SLAVA Symeon Sementchenko
    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 Symeon-Sementchenko-%CE%A3%CE%A5%CE%93%CE%A7%CE%A1%CE%9F%CE%9D%CE%9F%CE%A3-%CE%97%CE%A1%CE%A9%CE%91%CE%A3-%CE%9F%CE%A5%CE%9A%CE%A1%CE%91%CE%9D%CE%99%CE%91%CE%A3

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    Post  arpakola Thu Oct 09, 2014 4:18 pm

    There is an emergency for Lugansk and Donietsk to start getting electricity from Russia or locally..

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #9 - Page 14 03_2008_451

    http://atominfo.cz/2014/05/rusko-chysta-reaktory-stredniho-vykonu-vber-600-a-vver-600/
    http://www.atomic-energy.ru/technology/34565
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    Post  Vann7 Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:42 pm


    [quote ]
    Ukrainian Defense Minister has just claimed that Russia is testing the new kind of tungsten carbide armour-piercing round with level of armour-piercing at 7N37 [/quote]

    What up with that round? does he talk about a tank sabot projectile that Russia is working? or machine guns?





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    Post  Werewolf Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:58 pm

    Vann7 wrote:

    Ukrainian Defense Minister has just claimed that Russia is testing the new kind of tungsten carbide armour-piercing round with level of armour-piercing at 7N37

    What up with that round? does he talk about a tank sabot projectile that Russia is working? or machine guns?

    7N37 is a round for OTz-38, they mean something different sounds more like they mean 7N24 for AK-74 which has tungsten carbid core.

    http://gunsru.ru/rg_patron_special_eng.html

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    Post  Regular Thu Oct 09, 2014 9:26 pm

    Testing. Another bullshit by Kiev. If it's being used then it was tested before being manufactured en mass. Pigs, manekens are enouff. Don't tell me they take dead Ukrs and cut them to see their cavities.
    7N24 as mentioned by Werewolf was tested more than 15 years ago. In fricking fields and labs. Then again it seen blood in Caucasus for sure.
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    Post  Regular Thu Oct 09, 2014 9:41 pm

    I'm very pessimistic about DNR as a country.
    I know VICE is far away from being unbiased, but gopknik biowaste like Roma is just feeding them.

    It sure looks no less looney than Maidan crowd. Or maybe it means that all Ukrainians, be it east or west are going through mass psychosis and they can't be trusted for themselves?

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