Russian special military operation in Ukraine #27

AlfaT8 wrote:

Waste of time to worry too much, granted Russia has disappointed before, though that was more due to politicians making stupid decisions.

They have traded some space for hundreds of burned pieces of Ukro equipment, and again thousands of kilos of meat.
Seriously suggest taking a look at Ukro cadres and how they "victorious" drive forward.
The land is FULL of burned hulks, they don't have the option to replace them...
They are being bled white at each meter.

Article by Sasha Kots done with defenders of Krasny Liman.
It gives some insight on situation on the front from the viewpoint of regular soldiers.
https://www.kp.ru/daily/27452.5/4656146/

Departure from Krasny Liman: "If necessary, we would have remained there to die. But the command came

Special correspondent Alexander Kots: Krasny Lyman had to be left so that a large group would not be surrounded

A column of trucks crouched sadly on the side of the road. Dirty men with empty eyes smoked thoughtfully, spitting through their teeth. They smelled of sweat and gunpowder. One of the units that had just left the Krasny Liman with a fight, breaking through Torskoye to Kremennaya. We had to leave this city so that a large group would not be surrounded.

- If necessary, they would have stayed there to die, - the men from the 2nd army corps of the LPR in greasy uniforms tell me casually. Nobody thought to run. But the order came to leave. We left Liman for Torskoye closer to midnight. In Torsky, a part of the settlement was already occupied by "dills", but there is no other road. I had to break through. They came under small arms fire, but fought back at speed.
Why the decision was made to leave Krasny Liman
Krasny Liman was liberated by Russian troops in April. The fighting here was heavy, the enemy did not allow us to approach, clearly working with artillery on our orders, adjusting the fire from drones. The National Guard came to the rescue then, who found a miracle device that detects not only drones in the sky, but also the operators who control them. Then our artillery entered the business, leaving the enemy artillery without "eyes". The rest was done by infantry and special forces.

It was assumed that in the future, including from this settlement, it would be possible to develop an offensive against Slavyansk. However, after a massive offensive in the Kharkiv region, the enemy, having regrouped, redirected his forces with an eye on the Luhansk People's Republic. It was obvious that something would break through. Kyiv put pressure on the entire new line of defense. To the north of Kupyansk, on the eastern bank of Oskol, where the enemy managed to cross the river and gain a foothold in a couple of sections, in the area of ​​Lisichansk and Krasny Liman. Heavy fighting went on for several weeks along this entire line, but did not bring strategic success to the enemy. As a result, he concentrated his main efforts on the Liman direction, throwing everything he had into battle.
The Kiev command removed reserves from Slavyansk, pulled up tank units from near Seversk, Belogorovka. The strength of the Ukrainian army, which was advancing on Liman, “squeezing out” one settlement after another, exceeded the defenders by several times. Foreign mercenaries and "flying squads" were again thrown into the battle on high-speed lightly armored vehicles. First, they cut the highway to Svatovo, then took fire control of the artery connecting with Kremennaya.

All this time, Russian artillery did not stop, which hit the arriving enemy forces, aviation worked, but the reserves that came up were only enough to hold the corridor of life along which our units were withdrawn from Krasny Liman. The risk of encirclement and shameful captivity became too great, and the Russian command decided to withdraw. The last units actually broke through the blockade, with battles. There were no troops left in Liman.

"We will fight on, win back the lost"
I'm driving up to Kremennaya. The last column just enters the city from Torskoy. Combat aircraft are cutting circles in the sky, air defense is working on them. This air confrontation is indifferently watched by guys on an armored personnel carrier with the inscription "Bratsk".

- Yes, everything, as always, - the men state. - There is really no connection between different connections. What is going on with the neighbors, no one can understand. By the time you interrogate the work of artillery on our targets through a multi-stage reporting system, the targets are already gone.

From the outskirts of the city, artillery and rocket artillery are being fired at the advancing formations. I meet acquaintances from the cannon division of the 2nd army corps of the LPR. They work non-stop.
“First, they cut off the columns that were coming from Seversk, then they hit the equipment near Belogorovka,” the gunners cheerfully report. - We tried to buy time for our boys to come out with the least losses. Well, yes, it's a shame, first Kharkovskaya, then Liman. Well now, rip off shoulder straps and leave your wife under her skirt? We will continue to fight, to win back the lost. Cats scratch, of course, in their souls, but there is still no other way out. Why cry now. But while the boys held on to Liman with their teeth, they managed to mobilize in Russia. We are waiting for Our reservists, we will accept them as our own. They are their own. And we will feed, and dress if necessary, and teach. Don't be afraid, everything will be fine. Together is more fun! Battery, runaway, consumption three, fire!

152-mm howitzers "Hyacinth-B" spit out shells to the ringing in the ears, enveloping the positions with a powder haze.

 Krasny Liman garrison stood to the last
By the way, the idea that the Krasny Liman garrison fulfilled the task of containment was also voiced by the authoritative Donetsk commander, the creator of the Vostok battalion, Alexander Khodakovsky. In his opinion, on the wave of success in the Kharkiv region, the enemy planned to hit several directions at once, including Mariupol. “But they ran into resistance in Krasny Liman and got stuck. To break our guys, they had to cancel plans and take resources from other directions, but the pace was already lost, the shock of the retreat had already passed, mobilization began. If it were not for the Krasny Liman factor, in addition to the Kharkov fiasco, many more problems awaited us ... "

This, of course, does not negate the typical reasons for what happened. They were talked about after leaving the Kharkiv region: this is a lack of forces, and mistakes of individual military officials in organizing defense, and the notorious "five hundred" (or "refuseniks" - contract soldiers who refuse to fight and leave the battlefield - ed.), who leave strategically important positions, and reserves that arrived late, and the lack of coordination between various units on the ground, and the lack of modern reconnaissance equipment ... But last of all, we must look for the culprits among those who have heroically held the defense in Krasny Liman and the surrounding settlements for the past few weeks . He fought to the death and did not retreat, until the last.
“For almost a month, the group corrected the fire of our artillery in the area of Stavki. The guys died in battle with superior enemy forces, including foreign PMCs. The men waged an unequal battle surrounded for days. They didn’t come out ... - Andrei Medvedev, a journalist from the All-Russian State Television and Radio Broadcasting Company, wrote about one of the heroic episodes. - In general, the whole work of this special forces group was one huge feat. The guys were the eyes of our artillery. Correcting the fire, they thwarted a dozen offensives of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in this direction.”
Most of our units, which held the defense in Krasny Liman, withdrew only after the order.

Now the enemy will probably try to develop success on courage. He can move to Svatovo, and to Lisichansk, and to Kremennaya. This threatens to cut the already Lugansk People's Republic, which, like Krasny Lyman, is now the territory of the Russian Federation.

Hmm i wonder now how bold are things going now inside the Ukrainian command. and how long the Russian command will keep this illusion of defeat before actually work things around.

zorobabel wrote:
In this case the soldiers on the ground said they gave warning about the impending offensive by the AFU, but were ignored by leadership. So there is at least the knowledge and competence at the tactical level, but not at the strategic.

In other words even here it's admitted that leadership got warning of this Kherson offensive. In case all their other means of gaining intel somehow failed.

As to them 'ignoring' that warning, that's just the supposition of these 'soldiers on the ground', and nothing more.

And where the Ukrs suffered huge casualties and barely any ground won before, they are now suddenly making brisk headway, albeit with considerable losses.

I'm thinking Russia doesn't want to scare them off this time.
And before anyone replies about this or that commander being sacked or anything being far-fetched - make a cursory examination of the preparations for D-Day, the battle of Kursk and certain naval battles in the Pacific during WW2; and you'll discover far more elaborate deceptions than anything supposed here.
Occam's Razor doesn't apply when the name of the game is tricking and misdirecting your opponent, and the game itself is of life or death.

Stealthflanker wrote:Hmm i wonder now how bold are things going now inside the Ukrainian command. and how long the Russian command will keep this illusion of defeat before actually work things around.

Ukrainian command as in NATO HQ? Ukrainian forces are willing to go great lengths and seem to be able absorb tremendous casualties while still remaining functional. Expect more advancing and throwing bodies to solve problems. I am surprised that artillery and airforce advantage doesn’t negate and stop Ukrainian groupings dead in their tracks. All the tools for it are there. Maybe Russia wants Ukraine to lose their steam? Not sure about the plans here.

I believe there is infighting in and around MoD. Some pretty powerful people have spoken. I don't think Lapin is to be blamed, as his forces were not posted around Lyman amd in Kharkov. There's more around whole situation than meets the eye.

If that's true then it looks bad

ALAMO wrote:

Hole wrote:
Kadyrov is a batallion commander at best. He only knows to assamble a few thousand guys and storm a city head-on. He would do this with every city in the fake state and loose 50.000 men with that approach. For him they would be all martyrs going to the heavens. But this is not how you run a operation of this size.

Still, that makes him tenfold competitive if we compare him with our friendly armchair field marshalls

Of course, but he is the military equivalent of Rocky. Pull the head down and move forward whatever happens.

caveat emptor wrote:I believe there is infighting in and around MoD. Some pretty powerful people have spoken. I don't think Lapin is to be blamed, as his forces were not posted around Lyman amd in Kharkov. There's more around whole situation than meets the eye.

You can’t blame Lapin today for what is going near Kherson. It’s premature to blame anyone directly.

Arrow wrote:If that's true then it looks bad

https://twitter.com/mdfzeh/status/1576643092907597824?s=20&t=MuF3wdqOBmUoRo4AEI8NHg

Collapsing defense lines! Collapsing defense lines everywhere!

Yeah suddenly the Kherson sector which was under the command of the 'competent' military district is under major threat as well.

Regular wrote:
Ukrainian command as in NATO HQ? Ukrainian forces are willing to go great lengths and seem to be able absorb tremendous casualties while still remaining functional. Expect more advancing and throwing bodies to solve problems. I am surprised that artillery and airforce advantage doesn’t negate and stop Ukrainian groupings dead in their tracks. All the tools for it are there. Maybe Russia wants Ukraine to lose their steam? Not sure about the plans here.

One thing where NATO/Ukraine easily beats Russians is in intelligence amd reconaissance asset. According to Shoigu, but I've seen similar numbers quoted by other sources, tjere are more than 250 satellites alone, that can be used for the purpose. With less than sufficient number of troops on Russian side, it is easy to find and try to overrun weak spots. Due to insufficient forces defense in depth is almost nonexistent. Look what happened at east side of Kherson theater arpund Zolotaya Balka amd more to the South.
Good thing about Kherson is that when they scramble enough forces it is  much easier to obliterate Ukrainians and their airpower superiority shows with full force.

I guess Russia is busy planning it's next offensive away from the lines. And in the meantime , they are allowing the lines to be fluid. Instead of actually holding lines by bringing forces in. Which they do have.

It's very frustrating as a spectator. It basically falls exactly into the propaganda narrative that the west has constructed. When the lines move the wrong way , it's hard not to get negative about it.

This forum , Telegram et al has become a runway train of doom. It's hard to stand in front of that train. You either join it or leave. A lot of members chose the latter. It is good to see that non doomers have some space again.

caveat emptor wrote:

Regular wrote:
Ukrainian command as in NATO HQ? Ukrainian forces are willing to go great lengths and seem to be able absorb tremendous casualties while still remaining functional. Expect more advancing and throwing bodies to solve problems. I am surprised that artillery and airforce advantage doesn’t negate and stop Ukrainian groupings dead in their tracks. All the tools for it are there. Maybe Russia wants Ukraine to lose their steam? Not sure about the plans here.

One thing where NATO/Ukraine easily beats Russians is in intelligence amd reconaissance asset. According to Shoigu, but I've seen similar numbers quoted by other sources, tjere are more than 250 satellites alone, that can be used for the purpose. With less than sufficient number of troops on Russian side, it is easy to find and try to overrun weak spots. Due to insufficient forces defense in depth is almost nonexistent. Look what happened at east side of Kherson theater arpund Zolotaya Balka amd more to the South.
Good thing about Kherson is that when they scramble enough forces it is not much easier to obliterate Ukrainians and their airpower superiority shows with full force.

All that is irrelevant. Russia is a modern military which has reserves and mobile reserves at that. Even in WW2 being able to redeploy reserves rapidly made up for thin numbers at any one location.
Russia also has artillery and air-power to cover wherever the enemy is trying to break through.
Russia also has its own satellites, it can detect where the enemy is grouping up, where supplies are being ferried to, etc.. Russia has considerable HUMINT; that's how it knew where to strike all the weapon depots and other targets.

And I would personally place little value in your info about fights going on in the Russian MoD. That's farcical.

flamming_python wrote:And we're not even getting into the topic of Russian rapid reaction forces such as entire brigades of VDV that are expressly designed for you know - rapid deployment, filling gaps in defenses or exploiting enemy weaknesses as needed.

Russia is up to something. But you and the other NATO fanboys, closet or otherwise - continue to do you. By all means. I shall humour you no further.

Exactly. In the last huge military exercises in Siberia and the Far East Russia send tens of thousands of troops trough the whole country. At the beginning of the year a few thousand men plus equipment were flown to Kazakhstan in a matter of days from a distance of 3.000 to 6.000km. In the last week alone there were like 50 videos of massive equipment moving in by road and train. But somehow Russia is unable to bring in 5.000 men with tanks from Belgorod or so which are a few hours away, even when you are moving in a tank.   And the whole General Staff is watching how some General takes wrong decisions time and again without acting in the first week or so? 

Keep in mind that the OKW (High Command of the German Army) thought it was a really good idea to attack that bulge in the frontline in the vincinity of Kursk. Even after the attack failed they were in good mood because their losses were smaller then the russian ones. Then the Russians ended their strategic defence operation and started a strategic offensive operation and the whole Army group Central turned into minced meat.

caveat emptor wrote:

Regular wrote:

One thing where NATO/Ukraine easily beats Russians is in intelligence amd reconaissance asset. According to Shoigu, but I've seen similar numbers quoted by other sources, tjere are more than 250 satellites alone, that can be used for the purpose. With less than sufficient number of troops on Russian side, it is easy to find and try to overrun weak spots. Due to insufficient forces defense in depth is almost nonexistent. Look what happened at east side of Kherson theater arpund Zolotaya Balka amd more to the South.
Good thing about Kherson is that when they scramble enough forces it is not much easier to obliterate Ukrainians and their airpower superiority shows with full force.

The Ukraines biggest asset is its suicidal human waves. All of this BS about intelligence is over stated.

ALAMO wrote:

AlfaT8 wrote:

Waste of time to worry too much, granted Russia has disappointed before, though that was more due to politicians making stupid decisions.

They have traded some space for hundreds of burned pieces of Ukro equipment, and again thousands of kilos of meat.
Seriously suggest taking a look at Ukro cadres and how they "victorious" drive forward.
The land is FULL of burned hulks, they don't have the option to replace them...
They are being bled white at each meter.

The Russian Army cares for her soldiers and is getting cursed for it by some circles.

On the other side: WE NEED MORE BODIES! Reaction: 

Backman wrote:
The Ukraines biggest asset is its suicidal human waves. All of this BS about intelligence is over stated.

Not disagreeing with you. But knowing where Russian weak spots are allows them to make human wave attacks more successful. 
Also, in Kherson, they are throwing a lot of armour atm.

Hole wrote:
The Russian Army cares for her soldiers and is getting cursed for it by some circles.

On the other side: WE NEED MORE BODIES! Reaction: 

The problem is, that western driven propaganda is putting just the opposite to the people's heads.
No matter what they can see with their own eyes - the narrative is claiming the other.

flamming_python wrote:
And I would personally place little value in your info about fights going on in the Russian MoD. That's farcical.

Not in the MoD, but around it. This is just me speculating. Same like you that claim that everything is maskirovka. 
I take what Kadyrov, Prigozhin and,especially, Gurulyov said at face value. He was in active service till 3 or 4 years ago. New head of WMD used to be under Surovikin in EMD.
Generals are often political animals and not only interested in military.

The problem is, that western driven propaganda is putting just the opposite to the people's heads.
No matter what they can see with their own eyes - the narrative is claiming the other.
[/quote]


Western civilization, more precisely those who lead it at the very beginning, very "civilized" abolished all Russian media and all the most important Russian bloggers. In Serbia, TASS, RIA and other news media can still be read, but not video media. I have no problem with the West winning the information war and Russia winning the conflict on the ground.

Since 7.9. Let's see three offensive of the fascists and nothing is done to make a counter -offensive here.

On the contrary, the Air Force is unable to prevent the enemy's laying. It is unable to prevent the transitions over the rivers. She is unable to do anything.

They use too few planes, they do not use Iranian Kamikaze drones on the front. they do not do anything. No bomb carpets through TU-22M, nothing.

One offensive after the other and always with a lot of space gain. There are also no fire brigade units somewhere. Even the Wehrmacht was able to scrub and stop such burglaries with StugIII in 1944.. But here? Nothing happens here.

What should the plan be? Do we see an attack along the NATO border from north to south? Ukraine no longer has production. Replenishment comes from Poland. Finally closes this damn way! Occurrent and then roll up from the west! We no longer have time for half things! All or nothing!

^ This is constructive criticism. Some of the haughty smug doomers take note.

The level of daily missile barages towards Nikolaiv and Kharkov have reduced substantially too. The Western media will say that Russia has run out of missiles. Which isn't true. But i understand why the brainwashed would believe it

Does the Air Force finally do its job?

War Monitor
@WarfareReports
·
19 Min.
Russia strategic bombers and warplanes have began working on these advancements.

War Monitor
@WarfareReports
·
10 Min.
Ukrainian offensive has halted around the Dudchany area, heavy battles are being reported.

This psyop is really F'ing annoying.

Podlodka77 wrote:



* More than 35 employees were killed as a result of the airborne strike on the building of the SBU in Dnepropetrovsk

As a result of the strike of the VKS on September 29 on the building of the SBU in Dnepropetrovsk, according to updated data, more than 35 employees were destroyed - Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation.
"According to updated data, as a result of a high-precision missile attack by the Russian Aerospace Forces on September 29 this year on the building of the Security Service of Ukraine in the city of Dnepropetrovsk,

more than 35 SBU employees, including foreign advisers

were killed. About 40 SBU employees are listed as missing," - Konashenkov said.

sounds like a good beginning, now in Kiev please