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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39

    Backman
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    Post  Backman Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:43 pm

    There was a link to this article in the M of A comments. Here is some of the important parts. The author has some doubts about what the actual plan is for this war. I am not a doomer but the article touches on some things that are at least worth a thought.


    Russia Has No Strategy For Winning This War

    If you look at and analyze the Not-War on the strategic level, well, you can’t help but come to the conclusions and talking points presented by the pessimists.

    But the narrative has now shifted and the discussion is being framed on the tactical level. That is, the events around Bakhmut are what the Russian news and the commentators are talking about now. But the action around Bakhmut is a tactical one. There are three levels to military operations, at least in the Russian school.

    The founder of Wagner PMC Yevgeny Prigozhin denied the information about the encirclement of 1.5 thousand Ukrainian soldiers near Bakhmut (Artemovsk). His comment is published by Prigozhin’s press service in the official telegram channel. He noted that the Ukrainians are putting up strong resistance and Bakhmut (Artemovsk) will not be taken in the near future. “In all directions, the enemy is becoming more active, pulling up more and more new reserves. Every day, from 300 to 500 new fighters approach Bakhmut in all directions. Artillery fire intensifies every day,” said Yevgeny Prigozhin.

    Contrast this with the early days of the war where entire swaths of Ukraine were being colored in on maps and shared by Russia pundits and bloggers. Now, they’re coloring in fields and factories and little farms. And they’re trying to keep the same level of hype going as when they were talking about entire provinces being taken. Or, perhaps they will show videos of a tank getting blown up. Or a platoon of soldiers getting a grenade dropped on them from a drone. Very interesting footage, don’t get me wrong. We are seeing a different kind of war — a mix of WWI trench warfare and mini-Stalingrads.

    But it is undeniable that a certain “zoom-in” has occurred. At best, we’re talking endlessly about towns that have been fought over for months now. Having a discussion about the tactical level of things is a worthy pursuit in its own right. But not when it is presented in the context of a bait and switch. That is, we were promised large scale offensives. However fierce the fighting is in Bakhmut, it doesn’t take away from the fact that everywhere else on the frontlines, we are at a standstill. Furthermore, people are drawing conclusions about the state of the war on the strategic level based on tactical level data.

    I will give you a concrete example of what I mean. Bakhmut, even if taken, will not be exploited on an operational level. That is, there is no follow-up planned. I have been saying this for months now. There are no large concentrations of tanks and reserve troops to throw at the enemy once Bakhmut, a key point in the Ukrainian defensive line (or so we are told), finally falls to Ukraine.

    In the early days, we saw a clear strategy reflected by large troop movements, rapid breakthroughs and consolidation of territory and so on. Since then, we have seen very little of the same kind of warfare.  And after that, we well and truly saw nothing resembling a coherent strategy from Russia at all. Only feuding among its feudal commanders and an attempt to hold a defensive line. At the moment, there are no large concentrations of fresh Russian forces anywhere, except perhaps, in Belarus [or in the south, near Mariuple and Melitople ahead of the expected Ukrainian advance].

    We have no idea what Russia’s plans are on the strategic level at this point. Putin’s speech did nothing to clarify this.

    If the strategy is to engage in attrition warfare, then simply do the math yourselves. How many years of fighting will it take at this pace to destroy the Ukrainian army, which stands at 700k now, at least, and whose numbers continue to climb and which, in theory anyway, could easily draft another million men? And, of course, their ranks are being supplemented by Western mercenaries all the while. Poland openly admits to training tank crews and sending officers into Ukraine and so does NATO.

    If, on the strategic level, the goal is to engage in attrition warfare, then it simply isn’t working fast enough.

    Many pessimistic pro-Russian analysts have already come to this conclusion and point out that a new strategy is necessary. That Russia needs to fight this war like wars are normally fought. Russia needs to focus on seizing territory and strategic objectives, on breaking through enemy lines and then enveloping their positions. More men and equipment are needed to achieve decisive victories that can then be followed up on and the war concluded more rapidly, not strung out, with the number of dead steadily rising and progressively more and more of the Ukraine left in smoldering ruins.

    By narrowing in our focus on the tactical level fighting over a barn in Bakhmut or Ugledar, we lose sight of the strategic goals of the war. Full article https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/russia-has-no-strategy-for-winning

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:52 pm

    1)Russia gets islamists to blow up a major US ship or something similar

    Giving arms and intelligence to Islamists against your rival. Where have I heard that one before.

    2)Russia arms Syria to blitz US operations in Syria once and for all.

    You would sacrifice Syria as the US sacrificed the Ukraine?
    Syria needs to build up its strength and recover from the war. While working to undermine and isolate the US presence and its local allies, but no open hostilities.

    3)A massive cyber attack on US/GATO infrastructures. To include mass production of fake banknotes etc

    They can do the same thing.

    4)E-warfare attack on US/Europe with "plausible deniability".

    They can do the same thing.

    5)Russia arms US separatist groups - blacks, Injuns, Hawaians.

    What's next, supporting the Virginia seperatist movement too?

    6)Russia causes a coup somewhere - Moldova... perhaps Mexico or Catalonia or a more daring ie failed coup or major civil unrest in France or N Ireland or even Scotland. Perhaps one doomed to fail but enough to unsettle "comfortable minds)

    Russia has no instruments to organize such coups anywhere. And from an optics point of view it won't look great, you're presenting an alternative way of organizing the world to other countries but then you go and get up to the same sort of shenanigance.
    Yes the reigning regimes in France and Catalonia/Spain are enemies, but its more effective to delegitimize and malign them rather than get your hands dirty directly when you haven't even been able to pull off a coup against an unpopular government in Montenegro, or at least that's what the West alleged a couple years back. In fact when it comes to delegitimizing, these governments do a better job of doing it to themselves over time, than anything Russia does. Just let them carry on shooting themselves in the foot with sanctions and involving themselves in a war far away from them.

    7)Mass production of drones with Chinese help.

    Will happen if it needs to happen

    8)Getting a Russian base in Hungary and then connecting a strangle line from Hung to Belarus.

    Hungary's not going to involve itself, certainly not while Russia has no land connection to it

    9) Getting an "unaligned" group to assassinate 'elensky or one of his controllers.

    Basically the same as assassinating him directly, there's no reason to make things more elaborate than they need to be.
    Aside from the diplomatic consenquences though, and Russia does have to keep the interests in mind of the countries that are sticking their necks out diplomatically for Russia, there is also the matter of a replacement to Z potentially proving himself more competent. And would be better protected this time around

    10)Getting China to retake Taiwan and promising mutual support.

    China doesn't need it, and avoiding too close a coupling to their own plans affords Russia more strategic maneuverability.

    11)Arming N Korea substantially.

    No doubt that's coming

    12)Arming/supporting "Trumpists" in a massive action.

    Judging by the Russiagate hoax, it would probably be counterproductive

    13)Leaking incriminating evidence eg Covid, Biowarfare, 911, fixed US elections etc.

    Already being done

    14)Complete cessation of trade to the West.

    They've been doing that themselves. Nothing for Russia to do here. Where it does still trade with the West, it benefits Russia itself as much if not more.

    15)Anything else anyone can think of.

    Just carry on as now, the West does most of the work for Russia.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    mnztr


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    Post  mnztr Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:53 pm

    Something I haven't seen yet. A VDV team on quad carrying support weapon, ATGM and AGS. Nice! wrote:


    Pretty cool how they are long gone as you hear the grenades arriving in the distance.

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    Post  mnztr Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:56 pm

    I will add on a side note that a big discovery of this conflict is 98.9 percent of "osint experts" and devotees are idiots, or at best midwits that think more of their abilities than they should wrote:

    Gotta agree with that one. One moron was claiming he refuted the Hersch article based on transponder data of Norwegian planes and ships. I mean OMG using transponders to cover up shit is like covert for dummies level.

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    Post  Hole Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:00 pm

    If, on the strategic level, the goal is to engage in attrition warfare, then it simply isn’t working fast enough.
    Shows how much this author knows. Attrition warfare working not fast enough.  Rolling Eyes

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:08 pm

    Post Hole Today at 5:00 pm

    If, on the strategic level, the goal is to engage in attrition warfare, then it simply isn’t working fast enough.
    Shows how much this author knows. Attrition warfare working not fast enough. Rolling Eyes


    Well, you know how it works in some minds.
    If I don't understand something, it must be stupid.
    People sometimes have an issue just sitting calm and watching the show.

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    Post  Hannibal Barca Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:09 pm

    Sujoy wrote:https://servimg.com/view/17812518/229


    Yeah there is a very limited number of people disgusted by United States international presence. This require deep analysis.
    I think it has to do with the technological advantage.
    Because economy, gone.
    Culture, gone.
    Military, they are really skilled in climbing roofs, aren't they?
    Manufacturing, gone.
    Quality of life, gone.
    Economy, dying except if you are already mega millioner.

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    Post  Hole Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:18 pm

    Someone posted on Twitter that the polish Leo2´s are back in Poland for maintenance.
    Needs confirmation but wouldn´t surprise me. It was just a photo op for some politicians.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39 - Page 13 Fp0ux310
    Moving, moving, moving...

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    Post  AlfaT8 Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:47 pm

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:48 pm

    Jahodne taken.

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    Post  mnztr Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:59 pm

    Someone posted on Twitter that the polish Leo2´s are back in Poland for maintenance. Needs confirmation but wouldn´t surprise me. It was just a photo op for some politicians. wrote:

    Canada sent one weeks ago, and the Poles held it back so they can claim they sent them "first" lol. Poles are so petty its pathetic.

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    Post  billybatts91 Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:06 pm





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    Post  Firebird Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:19 pm

    Syrsky is actually RUSSIAN born, and graduated from a military academy in Moscow. : /

    Why would he be in Bakhmut?
    Wouldn't he be a target?

    And also, given the closeness of Syrsky to Russia (like many other more snr hohol army figures), why the **** hasn't there been a coup or revolt in at least PART of the Hoholstani army vs the American puppets that infest Kiev right now?


    Last edited by Firebird on Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Backman
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    Post  Backman Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:26 pm

    @Alamo
    If, on the strategic level, the goal is to engage in attrition warfare, then it simply isn’t working fast enough.
    Shows how much this author knows. Attrition warfare working not fast enough. Rolling Eyes

    Well, you know how it works in some minds.
    If I don't understand something, it must be stupid.
    People sometimes have an issue just sitting calm and watching the show.

    I posted it because I am curious what guys like you think of it. I am mostly on board with your view but just want to reminisce about some other takes on it.

    For example. This part. We dont know if an operational level attack is planned for when Bakhmut falls. But wouldn't it be a good idea if there was ?

    Bakhmut, even if taken, will not be exploited on an operational level. That is, there is no follow-up planned.

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    Post  caveat emptor Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:27 pm

    Lancets in action:

    https://t.me/sashakots/38654

    "Lancets", of course, are one of the main discoveries of the past year, which continues to delight with unique shots of the destruction of enemy artillery.

    In February alone, and only by these Russian-made kamikaze drones in the direction of Kremennaya, almost 40 units of enemy artillery of various types were destroyed. More than two divisions. ( For English speakers, arty division, дивизион, is not same as military unit also spelled division in English, дивизия )

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:35 pm

    More on the T-72 in Berlin

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    Post  JohninMK Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:41 pm

    Not sure where, Ugledar? or when but look at the effect on the building it didn't hit  Shocked


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    Post  Backman Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:49 pm

    ^ Good. It looks like the militia is calling the shots. More cheap shots like that instead of the diplomatic war

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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg Sat Feb 25, 2023 6:59 pm

    This was never asked before - what is the Russian Orthodox Churchs stance on this war? Does it support it or stay neutral?

    Python? <looks around nervously>
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    Post  VARGR198 Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:10 pm

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    Post  Backman Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:22 pm

    Let's see that destruction again. I mean , what are we doing?
    Maybe there is some cynical reason that the Kremlin wants to fight like this..at least for now. Maybe they want to move people further east. And some of these settlements aren't economically viable anyway.


    The Russian govt just hates unpredictability and chaos. And that's why they don't decapitate the Kiev regime. Yet

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    Post  caveat emptor Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:35 pm

    https://t.me/milinfolive/97372?single

    Meanwhile, in the distant Sumy region, previously captured and repaired Russian armored vehicles are being loaded onto railway tracks and sent to the eastern front.

    Judging by the undisguised loading and the very presence of a report from local TV, Ukrainian servicemen are not afraid of any missile or air strikes. Well, it’s understandable, the target is clearly not a priority, it’s better to bomb some kind of transformer, and the Sumy region is apparently very far away, missiles won’t get there.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39 - Page 13 Img_2116Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39 - Page 13 Img_2117Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39 - Page 13 Img_2118

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    Post  Odin of Ossetia Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:42 pm





    Above excellent post about the Russians having wrong priorities with regards to their bombing and rocketing targets.

    I guess Putin does not want to hurt his super precious and always beloved ethnic Ukrainians too much.



    It is like after the Georgian invasion of South Ossetia, there was a significant Ukrainian involvement in it supporting the Georgian side, but Putin's response was essentially to provide Ukraine with lots of free money and free natural gas.


    http://asaland.proboards.com/thread/302/ukraine-participated-invasion-south-ossetia


    This only emboldens the Ukrainians.



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    Post  Belisarius Sat Feb 25, 2023 7:51 pm

    And how do you know it's in Sumy and not western Ukraine?
    Should Russia keep track of everything that moves, 24/7 in the hundreds of thousands of square kilometers of Ukrainian territory?

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    Post  Hole Sat Feb 25, 2023 9:05 pm

    Not sure where, Ugledar? or when but look at the effect on the building it didn't hit 
    Vehicle was used against fighters in some forest. The explosion in the building was used as comparison for the strength of the explosion.

    Why would he be in Bakhmut?
    He visited Soledar shortly before the liberation.

    From Moon of Alabama
    He counted the losses of the Ukros in the last month:

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #39 - Page 13 Ukart110


    Last edited by Hole on Sat Feb 25, 2023 9:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

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