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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60

    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:09 am

    (deleted post)


    Last edited by higurashihougi on Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:24 am; edited 1 time in total
    Sujoy
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    Post  Sujoy Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:17 am

    Russia should get these 600 MM rockets from North Korea. Cheap, efficient and will be extremely effective against Ukrainian MBT regiments. Plus North Korea gets some much needed income.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60 - Page 36 Gxxbsk10


    Last edited by Sujoy on Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:27 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  flamming_python Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:19 am

    North Korea has a lot of cool shit, actually.

    And yes if things with NATO escalate then we will be doing brisk business with them, you can bet

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    Post  Sujoy Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:29 am

    flamming_python wrote:North Korea has a lot of cool shit, actually.

    And yes if things with NATO escalate then we will be doing brisk business with them, you can bet
    600 MM rockets will be much more effective than any Storm Shadow or similar cruise missile that Ukraine operates. And they come at a fraction of a cost. Even China hasn't developed 600MM. IIRC the max they have is 400MM.

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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:31 am

    Hole wrote:
    Considering the condition of the bodies, they are there for a while, so they probably have been liquidated a while ago and left behind by comrades.
    According to Cocainsky all is going as planned.
    He is leading a death cult.

    No complaints here, wish them many successes

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    Post  Arrow Sat Sep 14, 2024 8:41 am

    They are prepared to sacrifice their embassies for that. But if they didn't think they could get away with it, if they thought it would actually lead to WW3, then they wouldn't dare. For as much as they fear losing their little empire and its printing press hegemony, they fear losing their lives more, as anyone would. wrote:

    The problem is that the West has stopped fearing, fearing Russia's strategic nuclear weapons. At the beginning of the conflict, no one thought that the West would go so far.

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    Post  nomadski Sat Sep 14, 2024 10:14 am

    So the West " claims , " they will " allow, " use of long range weapon( s) " inside , " Russia ! Yes there are a lot of unknowns about this statement : ( 1 ) At one extreme , it could be simply for propaganda , political pressure , why advertise it in advance ? ( 2 ) It could be a symbolic act of a few strikes against low value targets or empty spaces , for the same purposes . ( 3 ) It could be some strikes against military or civilian infrastructure , for the  same purposes . ( 4 ) It could be significant strikes .

    Wait and see , of course also because after American elections , things may change , you never know . However Russia's response could also be calibrated and proportional , for the same reasons of propaganda and political pressure or finally be significant : ( 1 ) Starting with increased attacks inside Ukraine . ( 2 ) Symbolic third party action against western bases . ( 3 ) Some real strikes against said bases . ( 4 ) A symbolic atmospheric nuke blast on TV . ( 5 ) If no ( 4 ) , does not work , then a single conventional significant strike against western soil . ( 6 ) A single nuclear strike against western targets , warship etc , in open Sea or in space . ( 7 ) A single nuclear non - lethal strike against western soil . ( 8 ) Apocalypse ! Is this a credible escalation ladder ? Is it logical or sensible ? Where are we right now ? Where should we be right now ?

    Rolling Eyes

    Well 5/8 is closer to 3/4 , but we can settle for 4/8 !

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    Post  Mir Sat Sep 14, 2024 10:23 am

    Since the end of the Cold War it's pretty clear what the western elites are planning. Choke Russia and China with military expansion and economic sanctions. Since then NATzo has expanded from 16 to 32 nations towards the Russian border and China has been surrounded by hundreds of military bases in the Pacific.

    Fortunately they miss-calculated big time and Western Europe is already feeling the pain. Endless war is an extremely expensive business and it may well be that the US will find themselves on a deserted island pretty soon.

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    Post  Isos Sat Sep 14, 2024 10:37 am

    Arrow wrote:

    The problem is that the West has stopped fearing, fearing Russia's strategic nuclear weapons. At the beginning of the conflict, no one thought that the West would go so far.


    Not really. Soviet and chinese did much more during Vietnam war to help north vietnamese than the nato is doing for Ukraine today.

    Even France helped the argentinians agaibst the UK in the Malvinas war.

    Nothing unusual.

    This sort of things were stoped after the 90s but now the US started again. In any new conflict Russia willhelp anyone dealing with countries that helped Ukraine.

    Only Israel and South Korea were smart enough to not get involved because Russia could arms Hezbollah or North Korea with advanced weapons and satelitte images. They understood very well what it meant to help Ukraine. Rest of the countries that helped won't be forgotten and if a war starts they will eat russian Iskanders and Geran 2 drones operated by local russian operators...

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    Post  nomadski Sat Sep 14, 2024 10:41 am

    Time is important part of the calculation . At present rate of attrition of forces , you are right . Orcs will die soon . But in the six weeks before American elections , or even soon afterwards , the West could accelerate escalation to much higher levels ! Make a good few long range missile strikes inside Moscow . Destroy Moscow airport and kill a few hundred Russians ? Then waiting six weeks of doing nothing is no option . May need to go to step ( 5 ) and skip step ( 4 ) ?

    Rolling Eyes

    They may see this problem , and go mad .
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    Post  Broski Sat Sep 14, 2024 11:59 am

    Arrow wrote:

    The problem is that the West has stopped fearing, fearing Russia's strategic nuclear weapons. At the beginning of the conflict, no one thought that the West would go so far.


    You've got it backwards, NATO is conducting this proxy war against Russia because they're afraid of a direct conflict that would lead to the use of strategic nuclear weapons. The most logical response to NATO permitting strikes against Russia proper is a 300km buffer zone inside of the Ukraine, basically what Putin already suggested.

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    Post  ALAMO Sat Sep 14, 2024 12:05 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Not really. Soviet and chinese did much more during Vietnam war to help north vietnamese than the nato is doing for Ukraine today.

    That is very good comment.
    In general, there is a giant gap between the things that are being officially pretended to the real stance of the whole of the west.
    Polish ruling "elites" are among the biggest Russkie eaters up there - but only as long as nobody says "checking".
    Wired by suprice, it turns out that private opinions hardly represent the same level of shit.
    Vovan and Lexus just scammed Sikorsky, who is a clear CIA asset. Yet even him, thinking that he conversates in private with Poroshenko, claimed all different than he speaks openly.
    The very same situation was with president Duda at the same circumstances - he clearly bend over and admitted that there is not a single serious idea about any sort of war with Russkie.
    In the Vietnam war, a whole WarPac supplied Vietnam with tons of equipment. Thousands - literally thousands - of trucks were delivered by Poland only.
    WarPac military fought alongside the Vietnamese, and that was quite official - Polish air defense soldiers and officers were there operating both V-750 and S-125. Same applies to military pilots, all sort of instructors who trained Vietcong on the ground.
    This war is much more scary in verbal sphere rather than in official.
    And it is so only because of overflooding with information, both actual and figured out.

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    Post  Sujoy Sat Sep 14, 2024 12:46 pm

    Quite unfortunate. But arranging Ukrainian women for their incel men was always the intention of the West.

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    Post  franco Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:01 pm

    On September 14 of this year, as a result of the negotiation process, 103 Russian servicemen captured in the Kursk region were returned from the territory controlled by the Kiev regime.

    In return, 103 prisoners of war of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were transferred.

    Currently, all Russian servicemen are in the territory of the Republic of Belarus, where they are provided with the necessary psychological and medical assistance, as well as the opportunity to contact relatives.

    All released servicemen will be taken to the Russian Federation for treatment and rehabilitation in medical institutions of the Russian Ministry of Defense.

    Upon the return of Russian servicemen from captivity, the United Arab Emirates provided humanitarian mediation efforts.

    https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12529218@egNews

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    Post  Mir Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:14 pm

    Sujoy wrote:Quite unfortunate. But arranging Ukrainian women for their incel men was always the intention of the West.


    Law abiding Ukrainians just doing what the Chancellor demanded - working to make a living Laughing

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    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:20 pm

    Arrow wrote:

    The problem is that the West has stopped fearing, fearing Russia's strategic nuclear weapons. At the beginning of the conflict, no one thought that the West would go so far.


    Even Finland is now targeting Russian military bases in Kola peninsula with drones. Finland has carried out at least two drone attacks to Kola peninsula in recent weeks.

    All this can be traced back to Putin's numerous refusals to retaliate for attacks against Russia.

    Now the only thing that prevents Russia's hostile neighbors from attacking Russia -  which is fear as you pointed out - has been removed.

    I am a citizen of Finland and I have noticed and sensed the  change of mood here when it comes to Russia. Ten years ago Russia was seen as a big scary boogieman. It was hated then but also at least a little feared.

    Today Russia is seen as an incompetent and weak oaf. The element of fear is not there anymore.


    Last edited by Karl Haushofer on Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:26 pm; edited 3 times in total

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    Post  Kiko Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:22 pm

    Putin warns West of entering war, by Pëtr Akopov for RiaNovosti. 09.14.2024.

    Vladimir Putin has warned the West that there is only one step left before Russia will consider it directly at war with our country. Commenting on the discussion of the issue of allowing Ukraine to strike deep into Russian territory with Western long-range missiles, the president said that if this decision is made, the essence of the conflict will change. After all, the Ukrainian army itself is not capable of carrying out these strikes - they need data from NATO satellites, and Western servicemen will be responsible for entering flight assignments:

    "Therefore, it is not a question of allowing the Ukrainian regime to strike Russia with these weapons or not. It is a question of deciding whether NATO countries are directly involved in a military conflict or not.

    If the decision is made, it will mean nothing less than the direct participation of NATO countries, the United States, and European countries in the war in Ukraine. This is their direct participation, and this, of course, significantly changes the very essence, the very nature of the conflict.

    This will mean that NATO countries - the US , European countries - are at war with Russia."

    So Putin equated permission to strike Russia with the West declaring war on us? In essence, yes. The President reminded the Anglo-Saxons (and the discussion was supposed to take place at a meeting between the American President and the British Prime Minister on Friday in Washington ) of the price of the issue. This is not a nuclear ultimatum - no matter how hard the West tries to talk about another Putin nuclear threat in response, this is an open warning that we are climbing another rung on the ladder of escalation (far from endless). Formally, Putin's warning is calm and careful - "and if this is so, then, bearing in mind the change in the very essence of this conflict, we will make appropriate decisions based on the threats that will be created for us" - but in fact, this is a very serious warning. What did Putin mean and will the Anglo-Saxon leaders hear him?

    British Prime Minister Keir Starmer responded on his way to Washington: "We are not looking for any conflict with Russia, we have no such intentions in the slightest," but "Kiev has the right to self-defense" and "we fully support it, <...> provide training and opportunities." It is clear that following the meeting between Starmer and Biden, there will be no statements about permission to strike at Russian territory - even if it were adopted (and it will not be adopted yet), it is not in the West's interests to talk about it now. Because the United States is not only not ready to climb the escalation ladder, but also does not want an escalation of the situation on the Ukrainian front in principle: on the eve of the elections, the Biden-Harris administration does not need a demonstration that another of its bets (on Russia's defeat) is losing. However, Moscow assumes that Kiev will still receive permission from the Anglo-Saxons - if not now, then in a month, and a successful offensive by the Russian army only brings closer the moment when the West will not be able to resist raising the stakes.

    Therefore, Putin's warning is preemptive, so as not to be repeated later. What will Russia do after the first British missiles hit the Rostov region or Krasnodar region with the permission of the United States?

    Of course, we should not expect a nuclear strike on Britain or American bases in Europe, but a rupture in diplomatic relations with London is becoming quite probable. The times when recalling ambassadors meant the start of a war are gone, but even now this measure is a strong demonstration of the extreme aggravation of the situation. Another form of response could be the deployment of a proxy war with the United States in the Middle East - and this is not only the supply of high-precision weapons to the Houthis. A complete freeze on the supply of strategic raw materials to the United States is also possible, as Putin recently spoke about.

    Recognition of the US and Great Britain as countries at war with Russia will not lead to a fundamental change in the course of the war in Ukraine - we already understand that this is a conflict between us and the West for Western Russian lands (and indirectly - for a new world order) - but it will finally remove the question of the subjectivity of the Ukrainian government. Back in the spring, Russia, in fact, refused to recognize Zelensky as the president of Ukraine (after the expiration of his term in office), and we increasingly call Ukraine itself simply a tool, an instrument in the hands of the West. Not only the attitude, but also the announcement of the US and Great Britain as countries in a state of war with Russia will eliminate the ambiguity of the situation. The war from a semi-civil, semi-anti-Western one will finally become a war with the West (even if it is fought by a part of our own people) - and will leave us no choice but victory.

    https://ria.ru/20240914/voynv-1972598774.html

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    Post  GarryB Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:27 pm

    The West doesn't care about embassies or their mercs or whatever, none of that will impress them as it doesn't compare to what they're willing to do - hence any such retaliation will only serve to convince them that Russia is more afraid of them that they are of Russia and that they have the leeway to keep escalating and destabilizing Russia while Russia will never have the balls to hit them back.

    It has the reverse effect though because American soil is sacred and US  Embassy soil in Kiev is American territory.

    Russia will kill thousands of people keeping the country and the war going in one hit, and the US will have to decide how far they are going to go.

    They are prepared to sacrifice their embassies for that.

    You can say that easily enough but does that make it true.

    They folded like a deck chair on long range weapons use for Kiev even though Starmers team was boasting before the meeting that this was what this meeting was all about.

    But if they didn't think they could get away with it, if they thought it would actually lead to WW3, then they wouldn't dare. For as much as they fear losing their little empire and its printing press hegemony, they fear losing their lives more, as anyone would.

    Not sure what else Russia could possibly do... killing thousands of CIA operatives on US soil with conventional weapons... their only response would be a direct attack against Russian troops somewhere and most places they have rather good air defences...

    Russia has failed to understand their psychology time and time again, regardless if its actually 'weak' or not. The end effect is just a slide into more escalation.

    Bollocks. They are giving the west enough rope to hang themselves... Putin made it clear if the west allows Kiev to use long range HATO weapons in Russian territory Putin has already spelled out they can't operate these systems alone so that means any use would require assistance from HATO advisors, which he says equals HATO interference in this conflict... which the EU and HATO and the US are so so so desperate to avoid...

    We will see.



    Anyway, I'm repeating myself here. I'll just continue watching this trainwreck develop in slow-motion, what else can anyone do.

    Well obviously what all HATO agents do... predict Putin will fold and be super weak and then demand he resign immediately for something that was all in your own head.

    The problem is that the West has stopped fearing, fearing Russia's strategic nuclear weapons. At the beginning of the conflict, no one thought that the West would go so far.

    They have been threatening to give Kiev permission for months... years even... and like full HATO membership... never going to happen.

    Orcs will die soon . But in the six weeks before American elections , or even soon afterwards , the West could accelerate escalation to much higher levels ! Make a good few long range missile strikes inside Moscow . Destroy Moscow airport and kill a few hundred Russians ? Then waiting six weeks of doing nothing is no option . May need to go to step ( 5 ) and skip step ( 4 ) ?

    Making ridiculous claims about what the west might do is not productive... If there is a long range missile strike most likely the missiles will be shot down and Russia will see that as an act of war directly from HATO countries so they have a free hand to respond as they see fit.

    The problem for the west is that nukes are not an option against Kiev because they are already beaten, but add HATO and stir and the use of nukes might be mandatory just to show they are not afraid of using them and are happy to kill millions of people when their country is under direct attack from HATO.

    Even Finland is now targeting Russian military bases in Kola peninsula with drones. Finland has carried out at least two drone attacks to Kola peninsula in recent weeks.

    Funny you make that claim Karl, because Finlands politicians seem to be bending over backwards to say they had nothing to do with any attacks on Russia.

    Almost seems like they have joined the gang and don't like the games the gang plays...



    Last edited by GarryB on Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:30 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  franco Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:28 pm

    Russian MoD reporting 2390 Ukrainian casualties over the past 24 hours including;

    During the day, the losses of the Armed Forces of Ukraine amounted to more than 300 military personnel, and 15 armored vehicles, including two tanks, an armored personnel carrier and 12 armored combat vehicles, as well as two artillery pieces, an engineering barrier vehicle and five vehicles. Five servicemen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were captured.

    In total, during the fighting in the Kursk direction, the enemy lost more than 13,100 troops, 110 tanks, 44 infantry fighting vehicles, 87 armored personnel carriers, 703 armored combat vehicles, 423 vehicles, 95 artillery pieces, 26 multiple rocket launchers, including seven HIMARS and five MLRS manufactured by the United States, 8 anti-aircraft launchers missile systems, two transport-loading vehicles, 26 electronic warfare stations, 7 counter-battery radars, two air defense radars, 13 units of engineering equipment, of which seven engineering barrier vehicles and one UR-77 mine clearance unit.

    https://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12529223@egNews

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    Post  Mir Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:30 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Even Finland is now targeting Russian military bases in Kola peninsula with drones. Finland has carried out at least two drone attacks to Kola peninsula in recent weeks.

    No time for chit chat - you should be honing your prepping and digging skills. Like your chihuahua friends, NATzo is not going to help much when the shit hits the fan. It's like the job market going sour - last in - first out. Rolling Eyes

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    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:37 pm

    Mir wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Even Finland is now targeting Russian military bases in Kola peninsula with drones. Finland has carried out at least two drone attacks to Kola peninsula in recent weeks.

    No time for chit chat - you should be honing your prepping and digging skills. Like your chihuahua friends, NATzo is not going to help much when the shit hits the fan. It's like the job market going sour - last in - first out. Rolling Eyes  

    I don't agree with Finnish policies. I did not want this country to join the NATO either.

    And Finland should definitely not be targeting critical military infrastructure in Kola peninsula (as it is now).

    But I pointed out the reason why Finland is doing this. It is because the decision makers in Finland see Russia as weak and unable or unwilling to retaliate.

    And I'm afraid that Finland is correct in it conclusion. Russia's leadership and government are restrained to an extreme. So restrained that it has become a weakness instead of a strength.

    It would be all great if Russia's hostile neighbors would react to Russia's non-retaliation policies in the same manner. But they are not. They interpret it as weakness and continue to escalate.

    Just a few years ago it would have been unthinkable for Finland to carry out military strikes against Russia. But here we are.

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    Post  Scorpius Sat Sep 14, 2024 1:50 pm

    The BBC was afraid to sue me.

    Here's what they first wrote in their article:

    "She [Simonyan] called for cracking down on Russian oppositionists "by hanging" and offered to "send troops" deep into Europe."

    That's what they write instead of this lie now:

    'The previous version of this article, prepared by a BBC staff member in London, contained an incorrect translation of statements made by Margarita Simonyan on a TV show in April. We have removed them from the text of the publication.'

    Translators always get in the way of a bad editorial

    https://t.me/margaritasimonyan/14272

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    Post  Scorpius Sat Sep 14, 2024 2:04 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    It would be all great if Russia's hostile neighbors would react to Russia's non-retaliation policies in the same manner. But they are not. They interpret it as weakness and continue to escalate.

    Just a few years ago it would have been unthinkable for Finland to carry out military strikes against Russia. But here we are.

    I hope you understand that this may turn out to be the last mistake at all and Finland will simply cease to exist, right?
    Compared to Finland, Russia is a Leviathan against a small midge. If a Leviathan is bitten by a midge, it will either not pay attention to it, or its response will be so disproportionate that the midge will be destroyed.
    Currently, right now Finland is already paying with an economic recession for its hostile policy towards Russia. If they want to keep shooting themselves in the dick, well, Finland will probably cease to exist as a state in the coming decades.


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    Karl Haushofer


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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60 - Page 36 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60

    Post  Karl Haushofer Sat Sep 14, 2024 2:05 pm

    Scorpius wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Mir wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    It would be all great if Russia's hostile neighbors would react to Russia's non-retaliation policies in the same manner. But they are not. They interpret it as weakness and continue to escalate.

    Just a few years ago it would have been unthinkable for Finland to carry out military strikes against Russia. But here we are.

    I hope you understand that this may turn out to be the last mistake at all and Finland will simply cease to exist, right?

    Why are you asking me this? I don't make the decisions of our government.

    But I think Finland is safe as long as Putin is in charge in Russia. What comes after him is another thing.

    Odin of Ossetia and owais.usmani like this post

    kvs
    kvs


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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60 - Page 36 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #60

    Post  kvs Sat Sep 14, 2024 2:27 pm

    NATzO should not be so smug about attacking Russia. Russia can f*ck over their shipping into the indefinite future. The USA is
    always bleating about freedom of navigation while at the same time trying to control shipping choke points to control the planet.
    Russia can do more damage with less effort. Russia does not need to control choke points, it just needs to sink a few ships and the
    rest will have nowhere to go. The Houthis demonstrated this rather well and unlike Yemen, Russia cannot be carpet bombed by
    NATzO.

    Russia does not depend on international shipping to the degree that NATzO does for its economy.

    GarryB, flamming_python, Big_Gazza, Rodion_Romanovic, zardof, Hole, Scorpius and like this post


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