Russian special military operation in Ukraine #61

flamming_python wrote:

mnztr wrote:That is a pretty massive loss, 300 Iskandars, that is at least 3-4m at full rate production. What negligent fool left them out in the open and did not distribute them, knowing NATO is watching and Ukraine does have drones that can strike? Treasonous negligence

300 Iskanders? Ouch!

But what's the source?
We should be careful about trusting any old claim. There are also claims circulating that the Ukrainians actually launched JASSMs from their F-16s, with bunker-busting munitions, and that's why they managed to hit where the depot was vulnerable. But without confirmation or more info none of these claims hold any more water than any other

But supposing it's true, I'm starting to think it's a lost cause. Putin needs to go full Stalin on these wastes of oxygen but he's never going to. Really the more I watch this whole war, the more I understand why Stalin did everything that he did.

Anyway we should be thankful that personnel weren't lost, or at least that's what they're implying. Doesn't matter how many missiles they took out, Russia has the capability to produce as many as needed, and it's not running out of money either.

Based on what the Sat photo shows, you don't need a bunker busting missile, an FPV drone will set one off and the blast will set off the whole conflagerataion.

They will certainly not keep 300 Iskanders at one place. Be real a bit. Most Iskander missiles right now are on reloading trucks close to the launchers because Nato is playing with fire.

This things is just a bunch of BM-21 and FABs and 125mm shells. With maybe those north Korean shells there too because IMO their quality isn't top so they may not want to risk their guns.

Iskanders and 152mm aren't even stocked they go from production to the front.

... but you do see that you are torching up of nothing...?
Ukrs made one of the few relevant strikes in 2.5 years ...
Other than harassing civilians, with a pathetic outcome anyway ...
This is one of a thousands of RU ammo depots.
And again, you are on high because of the event is so fuking rare.
And you are not on high for opposite, because it is just going on as planned, daily basis ...

As predicted, a tough night tonight is underway.

MD
@distant_earth83
Ukrainian monitoring channels report that at least eight Iskander missiles have landed in Kharkov in just a few minutes.

Meanwhile Gerans

There is no pride to be had in stupidity. No-one location has any reason to store such an amount of ammunition especially a location within the range of enemy strike means.

How about we wait for an actual investigation into exactly what happened before we start firing people and crying that the world is ending?

I don't much care about the ammo destroyed, industries can quickly make up for it, but I presume there is loss of life too as such facilities would certainly be staffed.

They built it once they can build it again better once they find out how it was defeated... this will only make new facilities more drone proof... but nothing is going to be completely safe... that is ridiculous.

Agree that any death toll is the more important issue.

They're not making things worse for themselves at all, they are making things better for themselves, for they are NATO and their directly controlled puppets, and their priority is to weaken Russia.

But they are.

Putin has mentioned arming their enemies around the world and giving them assistance to inflict defeats on colonial western powers.

He has also mentioned sanctions on Uranium and titanium and nickle.

It also fully confirms to anyone with a brain they don't want peace and want to inflict damage on Russia and Putin.... so maybe it is time to hit that US embassy and start destroying buildings and assets belonging to Ukrainian oligarchs... and obviously level their power generation and heat generation networks... if they do it now there will be plenty of time for Ukrainian officials to organise an orderly exodus of civilians to the EU because there wont be enough energy to keep them alive this winter.

Consequences for the Ukraine as a state or the Ukrainian population are not even a consideration.

They never were... but when you make deals with the devil why would you expect him to have your best interests at heart?

You are using him and he is using you...

by Russia , shows no intent on retaliation against NATO right now .

They would have to establish who did what before they can plan for retaliation...

For all we know it might have been sabotage... a timed explosive hidden in an artillery shell or some such thing... Kiev is always going to claim drones or missiles... like they did with the Moskva, but it is more important to establish the truth about what happened rather than listening to those nazis.

Moreover, just now Bloomberg announced that some Western powers is contemplating a cease-fire to salvage the situation for the Maidan regime.

And such attacks will prove counter productive, because Russia can hardly trust such an opponent... in Washington or Kiev or London.

He will do nothing.

Wondering what he could do that will make everyone feel better?

On a proper website instead of dogshit ones:

I wouldn't wipe my arse with the Telegraph or any western newspapers...

The entire eastern flank of NATO has got to cease to exist.

His threats was sanctions on certain metals and arming the enemies of the west.

Perhaps he might send long range nukes to Iran and North Korea?

Why would he respond now when his entire history as a leader of the Russian nation is a long list of non-retaliation after another?

If he never responded Russian troops would not be in Ukrainian territory or Syrian territory.

I quit being emotionally involved in Russia's success for this reason. It is too taxing for your psyche to always be at the receiving end. To be the one who is always taking the punches (and kicks under the belt). To be the one who is always the one humiliated.

Funny the global south does not see it that way... Russia is at war with HATO and has been fighting for three years and has had western sanctions imposed on them... starting in 2008 really.... so is Russia isolated... is its economy collapsing, is it starving? Are Russians sitting in the cold and the dark with no power? Is Russia on the verge of collapse?

It is the west who have run out of sanctions that wont hurt them more than they hurt Russia and most of the existing sanctions have backfired and damaged Europe as an industrialised region. It is the west isolating itself... they are being kicked out of African and the Euro and US dollar are diminishing and are being rejected as trade currencies of choice.

The west is flailing and mostly failing.

They hit an ammo dump.

Get over it.

They are being crushed in Kursk and pushed back everywhere else along the line of contact.... they are running out of ammo and men and their international supporters are starting to no longer take their calls.

Ammo that was supposed to be killing nazis has blown up. They can make more. They are making more.

Now I am just an observer. It took a few years to shed off the emotional side but I guess I am fine now. Tver explosion seems to have been a big military loss for Russia but it did nothing for me. Not hate, not anger. Just a mild disappointment.

They have large numbers of ammo dumps and this was just one of them. They have ammo in full production. They are producing more ammo than they are using and they are using a lot.

Previously dumb bombs had to be produced in eye watering numbers because they are not particularly accurate so you had to use more to ensure the target was hit.

With cheap simple glide kits they will be using a fraction of the number of dumb bombs than they would be otherwise using, and of course artillery rockets are being used in enormous numbers too. Improvements in aiming and semi guidance systems improve their potency too without needing to be used in quite the large numbers they used to need to be used in.

I cannot understand what he thinks he can win by letting Russia to be humiliated.

Why does everyone else admit Russia is winning except you?

Are 2,000 dead Orcs per day not enough?

Russia is not going to surrender because Kiev got a lucky hit on an ammo dump... or maybe it was sabotage... they will find that out with the investigation.

Presume such a new facility will have cameras and other recording devices.... with offsite storage of course.

You waste your energy here. Putin will do nothing. You know it too.

What are you expecting him to do, that attack has only just happened?

You have no patience at all.

There are also claims circulating that the Ukrainians actually launched JASSMs from their F-16s, with bunker-busting munitions, and that's why they managed to hit where the depot was vulnerable.

Even assuming the Kiev propaganda is true then this is their first use and they get a few lucky hits and the Russians learn how to deal with it and it becomes useless...

Based on what the Sat photo shows, you don't need a bunker busting missile, an FPV drone will set one off and the blast will set off the whole conflagerataion.

You posted a conversation... normally a banning offense but I warned Karl so I will warn you too...

And to everyone... do not post conversations... my patience will not last forever and when it ends so does the quote button option.

Up to you guys... and I appreciate it is often a few that ruin things for others.

300 Iskanders?

Uhh, is there anything to corroborate these claims?

Because that sounds like a lot of pure bullshit.  As Isos and others have said, they dont place all in 1 area.

I mean, people can believe whatever they want honestly.

And Russia hit like what, dozens upon dozens of ammo depots in Ukraine. Ukraine has hit a few Russian Ammo Depots. But anyway, Russia produces so many missiles and rockets and artillery shells it outdoes all of the west.

Isos wrote:They will certainly not keep 300 Iskanders at one place. Be real a bit. Most Iskander missiles right now are on reloading trucks close to the launchers because Nato is playing with fire.

This things is just a bunch of BM-21 and FABs and 125mm shells. With maybe those north Korean shells there too because IMO their quality isn't top so they may not want to risk their guns.

Iskanders and 152mm aren't even stocked they go from production to the front.

How do you know Russia is not stockpiling Iskanders for a coming offensive. We know what a major push by Russia looks like. At Stalingrad 6000 guns let loose. This is a much longer front so the amount of ammo needed will be historic

Supposing that the UK supplies and then uses US satellite data to program the "long range" missiles, what will they achieve and why do people
expect Russia to do nothing about limiting their launch opportunities? The range of these missiles is at most 550 km. This is barely enough to
hit Moscow from the border of Sumy with Russia. Russia can literally establish a buffer in Sumy and Kharkov regions to keep these missiles out
of range. But it does not even need to control the buffer territory it can target any launch point. It has been doing this with S-300 systems
and their joke NATzO replacements.

Listening to all the yap about these missiles one would think that they will be launched at leisure and have infinite range.

They are stockpiling it. But what makes you or anyone else think there were 300 Iskander missiles there?

Anyway, I figure it wont matter much, they will be replaced within months.

If they are stockpiling them, then the missiles will be kept close to the area of the offensive, otherwise, it will take a while to move in new missiles when they are needed nd when the launchers need the missile they need them now, not a day later.

This complex was supposed to be super safe and modern and the size of that explosion, the aftermath of the damage there were big big missiles there. No way you get that kind of cook-off with mere arty shells.

Not to mention it kept burning and burning, which is a tell tale sign these weren't mere shells

The real question is why how come the complex so miserably failed if it was built to withstand the most modern weaponry.

Why did their air defense fail to protect a critical location.

This wasn't just a mere ammo depot it was a major major ammo depot, this was a strategic loss for the Russians.

Nato took its first shot deep into Russia. You can tell by how quiet the Russian govt has been about it. Yes, drones have done these attacks before. And in this area.  But never with this effect.

Like everything the US does in Ukraine, the deliberations about it were all just theatre. Unless Russia responds, the next attack will be of similar effect except on an airport or something.

It wasn't an F-16. They are dying for some F-16 propaganda so of course they are going to say it was an F-16.

@SeigSoloyvov

There's a reason why the US has been talking up deep strikes into Russia with Nato missiles. They were telling the Russians that they were going to do this.  And now they did it. Just like they were telling Russia that HMARS, F-16's , Lepards and Abrams were coming.

it isn't a coincidence that this depot was safe through years of war until now.

This is the whole problem with Russia's plan for defeating everything technically. They've done that. And the US just ups the ante.

Your missing the point th complex was supposed to be very safe from missiles and bombs, and yet for all reports it was just one missile that did this.



Btw Ukraine has every right to strike Russia with any weapons conventional ones that is,

This is war and in war, your territory is 100000 percent legitimate Targets.

Russia is also using shells and weapons from Iran, NK etc to strike Ukraine so hypocritical of Putin to be saying Ukraine can't.

So don't even go there, If Putin doesn't want Ukraine doing this then defeat them otherwise don't cry when Ukraine carries out a perfectly legit attack

There hasn't been an official statement from the Russian govt or mod on this yet. There's only been some claptrap from local officials.

A single missile, from the ghost of Kiev's F-16 is one of the reports.

And no. The US has no right to strike deep into Russia from Ukraine, in the Ukraine Russia war.

Through this whole deliberation process about deep strikes, the US hasn't even been overtly denying Russia's claim that Nato personnel would be operating these systems.

Ukraine has every single right, no matter who gives them the weapons and this ain't up for debate its war, if ukriane has no right to use supplied weapons on Russian turf then the Russians have no right to use foreign supplied arms on Ukraine turf

SeigSoloyvov wrote:Ukraine has every single right, no matter who gives them the weapons and this ain't up for debate its war, if ukriane has no right to use supplied weapons on Russian turd then the Russians have no right to use foreign supplied arms on Ukraine turf

Ukraine has the right to strike Russia but if NATO personnel operating NATO weapons systems on NATO orders using NATO recon data launch missiles into Russia from Ukrainian territory, then that's an act of war against Russia by NATO, doesn't matter if they call themselves Ukrainians.

Oh my. The panic on here is rather interesting.

Russias biggest failure here was allowing civilians in Kursk get killed.

A Ukrainian drone hitting an ammo depot isn't new.  If you simply do basic research, this isn't first time a Ukrainian drone has hit a Russian ammo depot causing massive explosions.  We seen this in Crimea and Belgorod too.

But somehow, this one is different, according to you guys.

What happened was that US and UK probably told Ukraine that this here on a sat pic is a Russian ammo depot. Hit it with your drones.  The end.  It isn't really hard honestly and a single drone can cause a massive explosion cause of cook off.

And here I was insulted and called lots of things when I pointed out an actual failure on russias end.

Which BTW, iskanders and Gerans have hit Ukraine earlier, after this ammo depot.

Even telegram or Rybar isn't crying this much.

sepheronx wrote:
But somehow, this one is different, according to you guys.

Drama queens lack drama.
Which tells much about the general situation actually

The British Foreign Secretary called Putin a "fascist" and said that the West should ignore the Kremlin's threats to use nuclear weapons, — The Telegraph (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/09/15/biden-pushes-back-storm-shadows-decision-until-end-of-month/)

David Lemmy said that the West should not be intimidated by Putin's threat of an all-out war with NATO if Ukraine is given permission to use Western weapons to strike deep into Russian territory:

We cannot be knocked off course by an imperialist fascist who wants to seize other countries willy-nilly. Putin said: "Don't send tanks" - we sent them. Putin said: "Don't send any missiles" - we sent them. Putin threatens to use nuclear weapons every few months. The only thing he should do is stop his aggression and leave Ukraine.
Lemmy's comment concerns first of all the US, which is still dragging its feet on granting permission to strike Russian territory. Joe Biden has made it clear that there will be no decision until he meets Zelensky at the end of September.

Lammy here is simply reiterating the sort of rhetoric he has heard in his own cabinet. He's not smart enough to come up with all this by himself. Not that there is nothing particularly smart about such language in the first place. These feral scum with their hatred will strike Russia whether that's sooner or whether that's later. And it may well be sooner.

Putin needs to pay attention to what is being said and the way that it's said. It's a level of hatred and contempt for Russia that was only reached previously by Nazi Germany. These aren't reasonable people. You can't make deals with them. You can only make them fear for their existence, which is what Putin must do if or when they do decide to attack Russia with cruise missiles. There has to be an equal or greater escalation in response, nothing else is going to work, it's just going to be interpreted as another sign of weakness. It doesn't matter how Putin himself thinks or calculates, it matters how it's interpreted by the enemy and here is Lammy explaining it in no uncertain terms.

Arrow wrote:Typical proxy war.Russia will not take any action against NATO because this is World War III.

There isn't a choice. If Russia does not respond to a direct NATO attack on its soil then the only thing that will follow are more NATO attacks and ones greater in scope, not only from the British but also the US, French, Germans and everyone else.
And no it's not a proxy war at this stage. It would be like if Soviet missiles in Cuba were launched at the US.

flamming_python wrote:
Lammy here is simply reflecting the sort of rhetoric he has heard in his own cabinet.

The Brits are the ones who have struggled with Russia for more than four ages, in every direction.
The outcome is miserable for them, but as always, in such cases, hurting their ego pushes them to engage in dumb behavior.

flamming_python wrote:....
Ukraine has the right to strike Russia but if NATO personnel operating NATO weapons systems on NATO orders using NATO recon data launch missiles into Russia from Ukrainian territory, then that's an act of war against Russia by NATO, doesn't matter if they call themselves Ukrainians.

This is all nice but are there any evidence that it was NATO?

Yes, Ukrs are way too stupid to pull this off themselves but common sense is not enough if you want to play by the book which Russia seems intent to despite being at war

So either get in the game or stop complaining about the other players

Backman wrote:
And no. The US has no right to strike deep into Russia from Ukraine, in the Ukraine Russia war.

Might makes right.

If the US can strike deep into Russia with Russia unable to stop it and unwilling to retaliate, then the US certainly has the right to strike deep into Russia.