Russian special military operation in Ukraine #59

SeigSoloyvov wrote:It's also humorous how Putin declared this as an "anti-terrorist" operation to clear kursk.

The man is literally doing everything he can not to declare war

flamming_python wrote:
I did however figure that NATO would go all in and try to destroy Russia, and that their ideological fantasticism and arrogance would prevent any settlement. They would much sooner sacrifice the Ukraine to the last man than allow Putin the satisfaction of a favorable outcome by negotiations. When the war broke out I figured it was only a matter of time until NATO boots would be on the ground too, and that the Russian people might have to sacrifice a lot more than some border villages in the Kursk region to defeat them. So far that hasn't happened, but of course there's still time.

caveat emptor wrote:

I don't agree NATO will get involved more with regular manpower than it already is, but Ukrainians will be exploited to the last, as they are seen as battering ram against Russia.
I forgot to add my basic view of whole situation: This is Russia's war to lose. Ukraine can't win this war without huge "help" from Russia's side.

flamming_python wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:This is the legalistic trope he frequently goes to, but many people in Russia  are pretty tired of it, this time. I think that he losses more trust with the people with these acrobatics.

No it's a move that makes sense. He's basically calling Ukrainian forces terrorists.
Which lays the groundwork for changing the approach to the war. Whether Putin will or not though is another question.

SeigSoloyvov wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:This is the legalistic trope he frequently goes to, but many people in Russia  are pretty tired of it, this time. I think that he losses more trust with the people with these acrobatics.

No it's a move that makes sense. He's basically calling Ukrainian forces terrorists.
Which lays the groundwork for changing the approach to the war. Whether Putin will or not though is another question.

This is some cope man, they are not terrorists, they are the opposing force in a war conducting a legit military action. This doesn't make them terrorists,

He doesn't NEED the groundwork to change anything, the man could literally declare war tomorrow and here is what the MOD would say "FUCKING FINALLLY"

I am honestly amazed you tried to argue thus.

He merely doesn't want to declare war and loose his ability to micromanage it, that is why he called it an anti terror operation because if he called it what it really was, he would have been forced by russian law to declare a state of war

flamming_python wrote:

No it's a move that makes sense. He's basically calling Ukrainian forces terrorists.
Which lays the groundwork for changing the approach to the war. Whether Putin will or not though is another question.

caveat emptor wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:It's also humorous how Putin declared this as an "anti-terrorist" operation to clear kursk.

The man is literally doing everything he can not to declare war

This is the legalistic trope he frequently goes to, but many people in Russia  are pretty tired of it, this time. I think that he losses more trust with the people with these acrobatics.

flamming_python wrote:

SeigSoloyvov wrote:This is some cope man, they are not terrorists, they are the opposing force in a war conducting a legit military action. This doesn't make them terrorists,

He doesn't NEED the groundwork to change anything, the man could literally declare war tomorrow and here is what the MOD would say "FUCKING FINALLLY"

I am honestly amazed you tried to argue thus.

He merely doesn't want to declare war and loose his ability to micromanage it, that is why he called it an anti terror operation because if he called it what it really was, he would have been forced by russian law to declare a state of war

Oh I agree. But I also don't care.
If calling them terrorists is what it takes to justify gathering reserves and marching on Kiev, then Godspeed!

kvs wrote:Invitation to suicide missions if they fly over Ukria.   But I bet they will pull the tactic of shooting off missiles from Polish or Romanian airspace. 

flamming_python wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:I largely agree with you, when it comes to Crimea, with addition that consecutive Russian governments didn't do enough by ignoring Crimea referendum and not having an ear for their grievances.

And it's over this issue, and over a similar one in the Donbass, that these Ukrainians you know are lionizing the 'existential war for independence' that you mentioned.
There would be no such war if they weren't such chumps.

You misunderstood. I said that I don't see Minsk as important, since it was created to give Kiev some breathing space. Merkel is on record with that, as well. These people blamed "separs" for non-implementation of cease fire. I don't see Minsk as any sort of solution. Intermission, as i said.

I understood what you meant, I just postulated that they were probably fine with a rematch because to rationalize not implementing anything in the Minsk agreement with bullshit accusations of the separs provoking conflicts on the frontline fed to them by Maidan media - requires some pretty heavy intricate gymnastics and I rather suspect what's behind it is an attitude of smug adolescent non-compliance with everything Russian and Putin while offering dumb excuses, or rather smiling coyly on while their government did exactly that.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

They have some valid, more or less, in their eyes grievances against Russians. And it was low hanging fruit for the West. A penalty kick. Make good returns with very little investment.

They can keep their grievances. Please stop oppressing our people on their own land though. Thanks.

You're not comparing apples to apples. Your closeness, be it ethnic, religious or cultural, makes it more tragic

I'm over it. You should get over it too.

I wish for peace and for every Ukrainian soldier apart from war-criminal scum to lay down their weapons and return to a loving home, alive and whole. Which would be possible if not for their own leadership which is leading them off a cliff even long after continuing the war has stopped making any sense.
And after that, I frankly don't want anything to do with the Ukraine and I suppose they would want nothing to do with me either. So we have a common interest don't we.

higurashihougi wrote:I do not question Garry's policy of freedom of speech, but I do beg members of this forum to understand that the Maidan regime is different from the Ukrainian people.

And as my freedom of speech is also protected here, allow me to say that any calling for genocide against Ukrainian, Amercian, or what ever nation, are completely disgusting and deserved to be condemned as crime against humanity.

People should seriously ask yourself that you hate the current Maidan regime because they are Nazi or because they are Ukrainian ?

In history a lot of Ukrainian heroes sided with USSR and Russia to fight against invaders. Are you going to ignore their contribution ? They sacrifice their lives for the common brotherhood country so that our generation treat their nation like shit ? Is that how we live as humans ?

I can see that many members of our forum come from Western countries, but they are very sensible humans who synpathize with Russia regardless of their government's stance. And a lot of Western people and Ukrainian people are sensible humans, too. Should they carry the crime of the Nazi Maidan regime ?

ucmvulcan wrote:

Could you fill me in? Who is this man? Is this a good development or a bad one?