Russian special military operation in Ukraine #61

Awaiting confirmation:

Russian Aerospace Forces Hit Two Ukrainian F-16s on Takeoff, by Alexey Degtyarev for VZGLYAD. 09.26.2024.

"Military Affairs": Russian Aerospace Forces Hit Two Ukrainian F-16s on Takeoff.

F-16s attempting to take off from the Starokonstantinov airfield were caught in an aerial ambush by the Russian Aerospace Forces and were hit, the Military Affairs Telegram channel reported.

In total, two F-16 fighters transferred by the Netherlands were hit, and there were also Su-24s at the airbase, claims Voennoye Delo , as reported by Rossiyskaya Gazeta .

The strike was allegedly carried out by four MiG-31Ks with the Kinzhal hypersonic complex.

There has been no official confirmation of this information yet, and the exact losses have not been reported.

Before this, Ukrainian blogger Anatoly Shariy reported that four F-16s were destroyed by one successful hit by the Russian Armed Forces.

https://vz.ru/news/2024/9/26/1289284.html

ALAMO wrote:They have dug only 14m underground.
Ammo depots goes much deeper.
That was the low level of excavation. The outmatch was not impressive either - the Brits get their noses scary red even after detonating a waste part of the front.
It was not the only one, only the biggest one. They have detonated more than 25+ tons in a different spots out there.

Edit :
By the way, I was just blown off by some conclusion.
The case is, that I have not seen the forest behind the trees ...
What we are seeing now, is a perfect example of old fashion Soviet-originated deep battle tactics.
The core of it is a multiple low level front penetration being used, rather than a massive blow to break the lines at some specified point.
It is a clear script of Triandafilov masterclass.
Slow and methodic eradication of defensive positions.
Along an entire frontline - 1200 km wide for a case.
What other tactics would be useful while advancing in the world's heaviest fortified and urbanized location?!?
Only the scale is different because Russkie are getting their casualties as low as possible.

Deep operations had two phases: the tactical deep battle, followed by the exploitation of tactical success, known as the conduct of deep battle operations. Deep battle envisaged the breaking of the enemy's forward defenses, or tactical zones, through combined arms assaults, which would be followed up by fresh uncommitted mobile operational reserves sent to exploit the strategic depth of an enemy front. The goal of a deep operation was to inflict a decisive strategic defeat on the enemy's logistical abilities and render the defence of their front more difficult, impossible or irrelevant. Unlike most other doctrines, deep battle stressed combined arms cooperation at all levels: strategic, operational, and tactical.


Exactly as it was written is exactly how it goes

Tactical phase is almost completed with Ukrainian defenses shattered

Operational phase is almost ready to be implemented

GarryB wrote:You clearly don't understand how Russian and Soviet anti ship missiles work... the wolfpack technique means one of the missiles will climb and scan the targets with radar and then it will drop down and allocate each missile in the flight of missiles a target... some targets, like Carriers or AEGIS class cruisers will get 4 or 6 missiles allocated to them to ensure a kill, while any remaining missiles will be allocated other targets to ensure a good clean out of the surface group.

Further they will coordinate their attack to make it more likely they will reach their target so some might climb and then dive on the target while others stay low.

Electronic warfare (EW) can effectively counter the wolfpack technique. Various tools like drones and specialized projectiles equipped with chaff, flares, or jamming devices are commonly employed to misdirect enemy cruise missiles.

Deploying multiple small active jammers near a threat emitter overwhelms its receiver and overloads its data processing capabilities, resulting in delayed or confused detection of the genuine target. These compact active jammers can be delivered via various means, including rockets, mortars, artillery, balloons, parachutes, or even housed within miniature remotely piloted vehicles (mini-RPVs). This electronic countermeasure technique proves valuable in off-board jamming of anti-ship cruise missiles.

nomadski wrote:
The only point , I would add to revision of nuclear doctrine , is that non-destructive , followed by low-destructive use of nukes should be considered first , before using them for pinpoint- destructive followed by mass- destructive purposes .  The cold war deterrence was established party because of numerous atmospheric tests by both sides  ( non-destructive , forgetting the radiation ! )  on TV , that cheated many concerned mothers of a restful night's sleep , because of nightmare of the Armageddon . This pushed many , over the longer term to chain their babies to fence !

Nonsense

If you are using nukes on a country then either incinerate it all to ashes or don't bother in the first place

Half measures don't work in nuclear (or any other) war

If you just nuke couple of places in a country only thing you accomplished was to turn remaining population of that country into hostile fanatics who hate you on religious level

Either exterminate the whole place and solve the problem permanently or don't do anything and avoid creating additional problems

lyle6 wrote:...

Each pipe was laid at least a hundred meter from the rest - yet multiple pipes were blasted - not ruptured - in up to 50 meter long chunks.

Only a nuclear device possesses such power.

Why are we still wasting time on NS2?

Europe has plenty of underwater pipelines, if Russians are upset over NS2 they can just trash those and call it a day

Arkanghelsk wrote:Deep operations had two phases: the tactical deep battle, followed by the exploitation of tactical success, known as the conduct of deep battle operations. Deep battle envisaged the breaking of the enemy's forward defenses, or tactical zones, through combined arms assaults, which would be followed up by fresh uncommitted mobile operational reserves sent to exploit the strategic depth of an enemy front. The goal of a deep operation was to inflict a decisive strategic defeat on the enemy's logistical abilities and render the defence of their front more difficult, impossible or irrelevant. Unlike most other doctrines, deep battle stressed combined arms cooperation at all levels: strategic, operational, and tactical.


Exactly as it was written is exactly how it goes

Tactical phase is almost completed with Ukrainian defenses shattered

Operational phase is almost ready to be implemented

Yeah this isn't so much deep battle doctrine, as the whole exploiting gaps in the lines and flooding reserves through is missing

It's just the grinding part of it repeated endlessly

PapaDragon wrote:
Why are we still wasting time on NS2?

Europe has plenty of underwater pipelines, if Russians are upset over NS2 they can just trash those and call it a day

Or reroute all that gas from Europe to Asia, there's only 5 Billion people there to sell it to.

S p r i n t e r
@SprinterFamily
Full list of the next American arms package for the so-called Ukraine worth $375 million

The new package includes:
• air-to-ground munitions (JSOW bombs);
• ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS);
• artillery ammunition of 155 and 105 mm caliber;
• TOW missiles;
• Javelin and AT-4 anti-tank systems;
• M1117 armored vehicles;
• MRAP class mine-resistant vehicles;
• light tactical vehicles;
• armored bridge layers;
• small arms;
• patrol boats;
• equipment and ammunition for blasting operations;
• spare parts, auxiliary equipment, maintenance and training funds.

In addition, Biden, within the framework of his presidential powers, approved the allocation to Kyiv of the remaining $5.5 billion from the funds approved by Congress.

The US President also ordered the expansion of training for Ukrainian F-16 pilots and the transfer of an additional Patriot battery and missiles to Kyiv.

Good. Increased range $1000 FABs need targets.

flamming_python wrote:
Yeah this isn't so much deep battle doctrine, as the whole exploiting gaps in the lines and flooding reserves through is missing

It's just the grinding part of it repeated endlessly

That`s because the exploitation is happening on domains other than the battlefield.

Its not armies overruning the enemy rear, but your corpos, diplomatic corps and intelligence arm running rampant across the globe cutting deals, forging alliances, and sabotaging the framework of western imperialism.

Western countries have trained about 127 thousand Ukrainian military personnel, RIA Novosti reports, citing a report by the US Government Accountability Office .

“More than 30 countries helped with the training of <…> Ukrainians outside of Ukraine ,” the statement said.

The Accounts Chamber clarified that America trained about 16% of this number.

In early September, it became known that US instructors were unable to train Ukrainian pilots to fly F-16 fighters. This was stated in a comment by Russian Ambassador to Washington Anatoly Antonov , posted on the diplomatic mission's Telegram channel.

At the end of August, it became known that the Ukrainian Armed Forces were creating new units that would recruit Ukrainian citizens who live in the countries where they were being trained . New mechanized brigades, each with 2,000 soldiers, were being formed with the expectation that the conflict with the Russian Federation would continue into 2025.

Earlier, an American general stated that Ukrainian Armed Forces pilots lack experience for F-16 missions.

https://www-gazeta-ru.translate.goog/army/news/2024/09/26/24016027.shtml?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

The weapon that changed the war  

and the transfer of an additional Patriot battery 

"Additional" because the rest was destroyed.

PapaDragon wrote " Half measures don't work in nuclear (or any other) war . " certain things in life can have half measures : The amount of sugar in one's cup of Tea ! ( 2 ) Victory defined by use of conventional weapons . The possession and use of conventional weapons , can give the illusion of victory . Since mostly their use , does provide a glimmer of hope , however slight , of outlasting an enemy , or surviving .

Nukes are an either / or proposition , there is no grades of alive or grades of dead . One is either alive or dead . There is no illusion of victory of outlasting an enemy , or surviving . But people forget , since the Beast is locked- up and collecting dust . But demonstrating the binary nature of nukes to the public , removes the illusion of outlasting an enemy , or surviving . So a process of educating the public is needed . This is not to be confused with half measures . The public then learns that the choice is to be or not to be . That is the binary question .

Zelinsky at the UN getting the audience he deserved but probably didn't expect. Brilliant.  

Baybe just! three fired

Zlatti71
@Zlatti_71
Launch of Kh-22 Burya missiles at Ukrainian Air Force positions! 09/26 22:10

5-7 Kh-22 missiles were launched from the Black Sea area.
Ukrainian Air Force is sounding the alarm.



Target hit. Snake Island. 26.09, 22:40.

This is what prompted the rapid launch of the Kh-22 missiles by our Tu-22M3 bombers. Colleagues report that several explosions occurred on Snake Island. It is likely that Ukrainian radar systems and a missile launcher were hit.

Following the action reported last week about an attack on a civilian ship carrying munitions, maybe another.

Launches from the Black Sea. The dry cargo ship, which was standing at anchor with the protection of a combat boat of the Ukrainian Armed Forces, suddenly began to leave. Probably won't make it in time.
- Geran231


Looks like another cargo ship was just hit in the Black Sea

- TalipoV ????????????????????????

caveat emptor wrote:News of the day is that, finally, nuclear doctrine was updated and made to better fit modern day challenges.
Now, it covers whole Union state ( meaning Russia + Belarus) and expands on nuclear answer against non-nuclear states that are attacking Russia with the help of a nuclear one.
This opens doors to a possible tactical nuclear strike on Ukraine, as well as Poland, in regard to its stance towards
Russia and Belarus and complicity in whole Ukraine affair.
Incinerating Rzeszów will be a good warning to the rest of EU sycophants and US itself.
Nobody can say that Poland didn't ask for it with their bellicose rhetoric.
More details will be known when up to date official document is published on Kremlin's website.

https://t.me/rybar/63831

 Statements by Russian President Vladimir Putin at the meeting of the Security Council Standing Conference on Nuclear Deterrence

Key points:

The use of nuclear forces is an extreme measure to protect the country's sovereignty.

Reliable information about the launch of air and space attack weapons towards the Russian Federation will entail a nuclear response.

A critical threat to the sovereignty of the Russian Federation and non-nuclear weapons will be the basis for a nuclear response.

Russia is obliged to take into account the emergence of new sources of military threats and risks for itself and its allies.

Russia reserves the right to use nuclear weapons in the event of aggression against Belarus.

The Russian Federation may consider the issue of using nuclear weapons after reliable data on a massive launch of missiles and UAVs when crossing the border.

The Russian Federation takes a highly responsible approach to nuclear weapons issues, seeking to prevent the proliferation of nuclear weapons and their components.

Russia has expanded the category of states and military alliances against which nuclear deterrence is carried out.

Today, the nuclear triad remains the most important guarantee of ensuring the security of our state.

In the updated version of the document, aggression against Russia by any non-nuclear state, but with the participation or support of a nuclear state, is proposed to be considered as a joint attack on the Russian Federation.

Incinerate Rzeszow? In case you do not know it, ethnic Poles increasingly hate ethnic Ukrainians. Ignore that puppet Sikorski and his UN stunts. I say arm the New Polish Resistance Movement, and let them launch attacks on bases like the one in Rzeszow.


https://asaland.proboards.com/thread/535/polish-resistance-movement-derails-supplies



How about incinerate Kiev or Lviv?



http://asaland.proboards.com/thread/302/ukraine-participated-invasion-south-ossetia

http://asaland.proboards.com/thread/264/georgian-losses-reports

"Four Americans at once": "Daggers" caught F-16 at the Ukrainian Armed Forces airfield in Starokostiantyniv, 09.26.2024.

After a short break, the Russian Armed Forces have once again begun to strike enemy targets in various regions of Ukraine. Explosions are heard in Starokostiantyniv and the Kramatorsk district. The night before, in the Kyiv region, Russian forces attacked the locations of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and the Main Intelligence Directorate personnel, as well as the enemy's radar control and electronic warfare systems.

In the Khmelnytsky region, the destruction of airfield infrastructure continues, where Russian Gerans regularly attack Starokostiantyniv. Strikes were also carried out on targets in the Odessa, Chernihiv, Kharkiv and Sumy regions.

Ukrainian sources report strong strikes after the air raid alert was issued. Monitoring systems recorded the takeoff of Russian MiG-31s, indicating the likelihood of the use of Kinzhal missiles.

“We must understand that the ‘Daggers’ are missiles that will only be used if there is 100% intelligence data,” writes Voice of Mordor.

"Apparently, the night strikes several hours ago, including those using the Geran UAV, were additional reconnaissance of the targets. The command considered them so important that they now used hypersonics. We can guess why. Good luck!" writes war correspondent Kotenok.

According to military correspondents, the airfield in Starokostiantyniv has traditionally been used by Ukrainian Su-24s, which served as carriers for Western Storm Shadow and Scalp missiles. The airfield has had concrete hangars for storing aircraft since the Soviet era. Perhaps this is why it was chosen to house the F-16s.

According to local residents, two powerful columns of smoke rose in the sky after the attacks. NATO F-16s could have been at the airfield. Some Ukrainian sources are already reporting the loss of up to four "American" aircraft as a result of this strike. However, as war correspondent Alexander Kots emphasizes, there is no confirmation of this information yet.

"At the Starokonstantinov airfield, two F-16 fighters transferred by the Netherlands were hit while attempting to take off late. At the airfield itself, an SU-24, modernized to launch Storm Shadow missiles, was also destroyed. An open storage warehouse with 12 Storm Shadow missiles could also have been destroyed. The extent of the F-16 damage has not yet been determined, but the hull and fuselage were damaged while attempting to take off. They were unable to take off, but landed normally. The SU-24 burned out," writes the Win\win insider channel.

According to the Rybar channel, four Kinzhals hit the airfield at once. The effectiveness of the raid can be judged after satellite images and other evidence appear. Ukraine and the West are unlikely to be able to hide such a powerful loss.

https://www.mk.ru/politics/2024/09/26/srazu-chetyre-amerikanca-kinzhaly-podlovili-f16-na-aerodrome-vsu-v-starokonstantinove.html

This war has taught a few lessons, artillery is still a key component of war especially at grinding down the enemy. Drones of all types and glide bombs such as the FABs that have been modified have proven to be very effective and very cheap. But in addition to this how having stockpiles of ammo, and armour has been a key aspect. The west has pretty much exhausted all armour it's capable of sending, ammo stocks are literally coming off the production line and sent straight to Ukraine with very little kept for it's own country of origin. Russia seems to have coped fairly well ammo stocks however did seek deals with allies and although some people think this is a weakness which is false but rather a genius move to buy cheaper ammo and quickly re-supply it's frontline forces only a fool would not take this opportunity. In regards to armour despite having supplied huge numbers of arms since the fall of the soviet union and faced two wars in Dagestan, a war with Georgia, and supplying equipment to Syria for 13+yrs and now the war in Ukraine it's maintained armour supplies and equipment and most likely still have 1,000's left in storage in particular Russia had huge stocks of T-72 and T-80 in storage as well as large stocks of BMP's, BTR's, MT-LB, BM-21 etc it's been pretty impressive Russia (1 country) has supplied it's troops with armour and equipment while Ukraine with its own stock and along with whole of NATO (and most likely non NATO) countries have pretty much emptied there warehouses and still Ukraine is struggling with equipment and yet the western media peddle the idea Ukraine is winning. What will be interesting is that after the war how much stock will Russia have left and what will it bolster it's storage with next and without a doubt having stock in reserve has proven to be a key element to war of this duration. Obviously we are hoping this type of war isn't something Russia will hopefully not be having on a regular basis.

https://youtu.be/ZAimQdyrQ5c?si=-dGGHBKr-tFPt-Ab

Ukrainian FPV takes out a Lancet.

The little progress Russia is making on the battlefield is coming at a high manpower cost. While they are losing less than ukraine, I don't think they can keep this up for long. There will probably be some kind of negotiated settlement next year.

bandit6 wrote:https://youtu.be/ZAimQdyrQ5c?si=-dGGHBKr-tFPt-Ab

Ukrainian FPV takes out a Lancet.

The little progress Russia is making on the battlefield is coming at a high manpower cost. While they are losing less than ukraine, I don't think they can keep this up for long. There will probably be some kind of negotiated settlement next year.

Hmmm even BBC shows losses are the lowest in the entire war

August had 325 casualties

That’s stunningly low when you consider they are taking the strongest Ukrainian defensive positions in days

The Ukrainians are experiencing diminishing returns while Russia is growing stronger inversely to Ukrainians collapse